“Paris is always a good idea,” declared Audrey Hepburn. I thought that moving to Paris was a great idea until we were living in Paris. If you’re coming here because you love Paris, you will probably love Paris (most of the time). If you’re not a Francophile or you love to judge strangers, you will want to read this 3,000-word long article on why we don’t like living in Paris as expats and why we’re leaving France.
This is my opinion about being an expat in Paris and based on MY experiences living in Paris, so please read it before judging me. I’ve included lots of pretty photos of Paris to compensate for being such a negative Nancy.
We’ve been living in Paris for two months. If you’re here to tell me that I haven’t tried hard enough or that two months isn’t long enough, try to read a bit before you judge me. This is the most personal post I’ve written in a while. As a note, I’m American and we’ve lived in the Netherlands and Belgium (briefly).
Most important fact to get out of the way: It’s a privilege to live abroad, especially in Paris.
There are plenty of things about Paris that I love: the architecture, food, wine, ability to travel within Europe, and rich cultural heritage of France. I adore France otherwise, but I’ll have lots more about great things to do around France as well as Paris soon. As a travel blogger and someone who is into history/culture, I absolutely had a blast going around Paris exploring secret Paris and pursuing my passion of writing.
However, I worked full-time in a very different career before we moved to France, which was a fairly quick decision with a fast turnaround (1 month). I’ll write more about the things I love about Paris soon, however there’s a lot of things I don’t like about living in France and this post is about my reasons for not wanting to live in Paris anymore.
I’ve felt like there was something broken in ME for not loving living in Paris. That said, I’ve sacrificed a lot to be here, including my previous career and my financial independence. I thought that I’d enjoy living in Paris and it would click, so I kept putting off writing this although I thought about writing it a million times. However, Paris never clicked.
I’ve posted a version of this in an expat group, and I was floored by the overwhelmingly positive response, including messages from people who felt like they couldn’t SAY it to anyone. It’s okay if you don’t love your new home. So, my reasons why we’ve not loved living in Paris, and why we’ve left Paris…
I’m not a Francophile.
I think that it helps to be infatuated with French culture although it’s not a guarantee that you’ll love living in Paris. If you’re someone obsessed with France, it’s easy to pinch yourself in the bad moments and say I LIVE IN PARIS!
Good for you, but the rest of us are here dodging dog poop on the sidewalk and hoping that the pickpockets won’t take our wallets on the Metro. (Side note: I love the Metro. Maybe I’m weird, but it’s a fantastic subway system!)
Dog Poop
I’m so tired of stepping in dog poop. I’m almost ready to buy little bags for every person I see with a dog. Just clean up after your dog. I have a cat, and I do the litter box regularly.
Paris is not what I thought it would be
I never expected Paris to be like a movie (like some starry-eyed Americans), but a lot of people come here anticipating it to be a dream full of champagne, the Eiffel tower, pretty dresses, macarons, and romance. I was never that person, and if you come here starry-eyed, you might be disappointed.
However, my husband got a competitive job offer in Paris and on paper, it looked good, and we thought that we’d live comfortably here as the cost of living in Paris seemed not so different from the cost of living in Amsterdam. It’s a big city and as someone who grew up in New York City, it works on that level, but you should expect the prestige cost of living in Paris on par with any world capital.
My biggest reason for not wanting to live in Paris: Unable to find work
I’ve heard from a lot of ex-pats who moved to Paris for love that it’s been really hard to break into their fields like they hoped that they would, even with fluent French. Don’t underestimate how competitive the expat job market is in Paris.
If your goal is to move to Paris and work in Paris, it is certainly possible if you work in hot areas (e.g. tech) where opportunities abound, but it is otherwise quite a bit harder to find work that isn’t teaching as a native English speaker.
A lot of trailing spouses who move to France are unable to work due to visa restrictions. (Trailing spouses are the name for spouses who follow their significant other when their spouse gets a good job abroad.) I was luckier than a lot of spouses that I was granted the ability to work due to an uncommon visa.
However, I was locked out of the labor market for my career path as a non-fluent French speaker. As someone with a graduate degree and international work experience, I was deeply frustrated to see the gap in my CV growing and the only work that I could get involved in switching careers/industries.
I had invested time in getting a Master’s degree and work experience in my chosen professional career. However, I really wanted to continue my career in Paris. I hoped that my previous experience working internationally in another European language would help for more international companies.
However, English-only positions often asked for fluent French. Given the state of the expat job market in Paris (which is quite competitive), being a specialist isn’t always enough for getting a job as a non-fluent French speaker (although it can be). I will say that I know people who specialize in French plus their native tongue, which is a great asset, but it also requires having fluent French.
While in Paris, I met a number of expats who moved to France for love who didn’t have specialized educational degrees past a college degree (if they did). That situation made it very difficult for them to be competitive on the general job market despite being intelligent, well-educated people with a good level of French.
If you’re reading this thinking on how to make your move to France go smoother, I really suggest becoming fluent in French and pursuing a good professional degree from a French university if you don’t have a Master’s. I moved to France after several years spent learning Dutch, which didn’t do me too much good as I didn’t have French.
Similarly, a bachelor’s degree is important if you don’t have one. A friend of mine has a M.B.A. from a French university and that degree has certainly helped her in France.
Back to my situation in Paris: Not being able to find good work has made me dependent on my husband. I typically don’t write about our relationship; however, Paris has shifted our relationship dynamic from one where both of us kept independent finances to one where I was dependent on him for paying the rent. For some people, this is fine, but I was not comfortable with it. I prefer our dual-income lifestyle where I had more independence, even if it gave me the flexibility to pursue my passions.
I feel for those reading this who have to wait a year plus to be allowed to work, only to struggle to find jobs, particularly ones that aren’t set aside for English speakers (e.g., au pair/teaching English).
Living in Paris is not the same as visiting Paris
I had visited Paris some years ago, and I enjoyed Paris a lot after staying with a local who took the time to show me her favorite places. Living in Paris is not like visiting Paris. Real Paris is expensive and seven euro beers (for a pint) made me cringe.
When you live in a city and deal with the bureaucracy and mess, you see it for what it is, and Paris involves a lot of persistence/resilience. I always thought I was a persistent person, but maybe I’m not that tough.
All the magical things about visiting Paris aren’t the same when you live here. The Metro is packed during rush hour and the charming hours of the shops become a lot less so when you forget to go grocery shopping on a Saturday for Sunday (when everything is closed).
It’s still a gorgeous city, and I remember this whenever I find a beautiful quiet street or look out at the rooftops from the window of my double chambre de bonne.
Being on vacation with minimal concerns about money is very different than living in a city with a limited income that is split between food, groceries, bills, and other things that normal people pay. I can’t go out to lovely restaurants every day. The city is still so instagrammable, but instagram isn’t always pretty behind the scenes.
That said, I’ve loved playing tourist in Paris while living in Paris. However, that doesn’t really dictate how you live in a city. I’ve been become obsessed with “secret streets” around Paris and just exploring all the different arrondissements.
However, you can’t play tourist 24/7 if you’re living in Paris if you need to earn money. My husband rarely got to experience this side of Paris while working full time and really felt like he missed out a bit on the better parts of Paris without the crowds as a result.
The bureaucracy
Every single Parisian resident hates dealing with the bureaucracy. I’ve wasted so many hours of my life sitting in the prefecture waiting room. Sometimes you go, wait five hours, and you’re told that you need to go to another office by a civil servant who criticizes your French on your first day in France.
Then, you manage to reach another office on the phone and you’re told that the original office was correct. Then, you return, wait for four hours, and you’re advised that you need to go to a different office.
It’s a cycle of frustration. If you don’t speak French at all, it will not go well without a translator and there are people in the expat community who specialize in this. That said, try it out without one and see how it goes. It might go terribly.
High cost of living in Paris / Housing market in Paris
Compared to New York City and London, Paris seems somewhat okay. However, compared to other European capitals, it’s pricey. As someone acutely pointed out to me, it’s my fault for wanting to live in Paris proper for my first couple months.
We pay over 1,200 euros for a double chambre de bonne. A normal chambre de bonne is a former servant’s room around 10 square meters with a shared toilet with 6+ apartments. It is up on the sixth floor of the building up a narrow staircase.
As the housing market is so tight, a filthy furnished apartment can be rented for an obscene amount of money because it’s a good neighborhood and an old building.
Also, real estate agents want to see your assets and contracts, so without a second income or some assets, it’s hard to qualify for decent rental apartments in Paris due to the income ratios that require making around three times the rent. Having a non-working spouse will not help much in this situation.
My biggest issue is the cost of groceries (although it’s cheaper in the suburbs). French food is excellent, and the quality of food in Paris is great. We shop for veggies at the local markets, but things are still expensive. Wine in France is well priced at many establishments although cheapest at the supermarket to enjoy at home. If you’re a craft beer drinker, it’s an expensive habit.
As a note, I was delighted by how affordable and GOOD healthcare and education are in France. Although we don’t have kids, I could definitely see how you can save thousands of dollars compared to living in the United States.
I’m not fluent in French.
I’m not bad, but I’m also not good at French. I stumble around hoping that nobody will notice how terrible it is (they all notice), and when you’re dealing with anything official, you need to know French. Similarly, to find work in Paris, it’s best* if you’re fluent in French.
If not, at least B2/C1 level is what people want to see, so if you’re intending on finding a job in Paris, work on your French for a while as you’ll need it for everyday things even if the job itself isn’t in French. (That said, Parisians have a decent level of English, so I’m a bit shocked when people complain about English not being spoken well here.)
We ended up here by mistake, however, if I had known that we were moving here a year ago, I would have started French classes. My bigger issue regarding French in Paris is being locked out of the job market for my career due to the language barrier. I was only in France for a few months and until a few months prior, I had been working at becoming fluent in Dutch.
Before you tell me that it’s naive to move to a country without being fluent in their language, I intended to become fluent long-term and I moved for my husband’s work, not my own. I am pretty good with languages actually. We only had about 1 month to figure out our move to France after deciding to move to France. It was a bit spontaneous, unplanned, and not really the best decision was given that my French isn’t good.
I started learning immediately after we decided to go to France and I have multiple French books that I worked through while living in Paris. I realize that knowing French CAN change your life in France, however, it’s impossible to become fluent within only one month.
What nobody tells you about living in Paris: You can’t complain to anyone
When you’re unhappy as an expat, especially in a place like Paris, it’s really difficult because you can’t talk to your non-expat friends about being unhappy abroad.
They often tell you that you’re lucky to live abroad in Paris (Reminder: You are!) and that they’d kill to be in your shoes in PARIS. (Paris can only be written in CAPS when you’re reminding someone else that they’re living [your dream] in PARIS.)
I’ve experienced this quite a few times, and it’s tough because you want to be close with people, but if you cannot be honest about your feelings with a close friend asks you how living in Paris is, … simply, you feel fake.
Similarly, when you meet new people in Paris, it’s tough to gauge the degree that you can discuss how you feel about living in Paris as an expat without risking your new friendship. As a result, I’ve rarely had an outlet for my frustration.
EVEN ON THE INTERNET.
You’d think that the various expat groups on the internet would be a good outlet for this, however many people in the expat groups in Paris seem to find it impossible to allow others to be HONEST about their feelings by telling others that they can leave if they’re unhappy.
Similarly, according to some folks, it’s always your fault: there’s something wrong with YOU, you never tried enough, your French isn’t good enough, or some decision that you’ve made has been terrible.
That’s the thing: I know myself and I’ve been able to shake it off, but if you’re in a bad situation, it really doesn’t help to be told that it’s your fault and you should leave if Paris isn’t working out like you hoped.
Remember that what is someone else’s dream doesn’t need to be YOUR dream. It’s easy to let the expectations of others weigh on you and bottle up the anxiety/frustrations that come with trying to make life abroad in Paris work.
Being an expat is NEVER easy, especially being an expat in Paris. Many expats say that it gets better after a year while others say that living in Paris becomes less bothersome over time as you learn how to deal with the bureaucracy.
However, many of these expats never really fall in love with Paris if it never clicked from the beginning although many head to other French cities and love living in France. They’re often in a love/hate relationship with Paris. However, they’re at peace with their decision to live here (potentially with their French spouse) and at the end of the day, there’s nothing wrong with airing your frustrations.
Hello grumpy Paris expats reading this….
To all the Paris expats reading this who are relieved to read someone who’s not glamorizing Paris, I hope you enjoyed this blog post. Being honest with yourself and others feels great. There’s nothing wrong with being honest about your feelings although not everyone will want to hear it.
If you’re living in Paris and not happy here, I give you a lot of credit, and I hope things improve for you soon. Facing your unhappiness is difficult and hard, but there are two ways to solve unhappiness: to face it head-on or wait for it to pass.
You don’t know how long it will take until you’re happy and I think that it’s important to take steps to combat your unhappiness to become happy again.
There is power in recognizing that you’re unhappy because it means that you can start taking steps to be happier whether it’s leaving or finding something fulfilling to spend your time doing. That said, I do recommend trying to see a therapist as they can really help you deal with depression if you’re dealing with that.
I wrote this post about living in Paris as a way of making others not feel so isolated for feeling this way about Paris and I hope this made you feel less alone. It’s not all sunshine, sunrises without tourists ruining the view, and delicious pastries. Don’t be afraid to share your story. You would be surprised how many people feel the same way.
I’ve also been delighted by the Grumpy Expat Facebook group, which is a place where you can share all your negative Nancy rants about hating Paris. Seriously, let that frustration go.
To prospective Parisian expats….
If you’re moving to Paris, I wish you the best of luck. It’s a TOUGH city, but I hope you love it. It’s not for everyone. However, it’s really hard to know before you move to a new city (or country) if you’re going to love it or hate it. I hoped that I would love being an expat in Paris, but I was wrong. There’s absolutely no shame in trying out living in Paris and being honest with yourself if it doesn’t FEEL right.
If you came here to write: YOU SHOULD LEAVE
For everyone who came here to tell me that I should leave, I left some months ago. Feel free to raise your glass of wine. I’m fluent in Dutch, love my work, and so much happier in the Netherlands.
To the keyboard psychologists/everyone hate-reading this…
At the end of the day, can we just be understanding (and maybe even supportive) of other people’s decisions without being judgmental? I don’t understand this pushback in the anglophone expat community when someone says that they’re not happy in Paris.
It seems that everyone is a psychologist and you’ll receive a free session analyzing everything that you’ve done wrong and/or how you’re a horrible unhappy person who would be unhappy everywhere. I was happy before we moved to Paris.
We were forced to move due to our visas expiring, so I think that has impacted my experience in Paris considerably as I spent years learning Dutch and integrating into the Netherlands only to restart from square zero. For me, the Netherlands is my happy place that makes me feel at home although it has its own downsides/quirks (like everywhere). Nowhere is truly perfect.
If your expat life in Paris is good complete with amazing friends, the perfect apartment, dinner parties, Seine picnics, and/or the perfect partner, good for you. I truly mean that. Finding your happy place is tough and if living in Paris makes you happy, I’m happy for you.
I simply encourage you to let others have a safe place online (or even to your face) to air their feelings as bottling unhappiness is bad.
Instead of analyzing WHY they are unhappy, let them feel comfortable to talk about it. You can encourage them to find hobbies that make them happy or even see a psychologist if they’re dealing with depression.
Not everyone is looking for pointers on how to improve, so unless you’re a certified psychologist, consider if it’s productive to point out these issues.
If there’s only one takeaway from this article for you, think when you hear that someone is having a difficult time adjusting when moving abroad. Be sympathetic and understanding. A listening ear can be really important when you’re feeling alone and sometimes you don’t need to say anything if you can’t be supportive. Or even better, be supportive.
Update: We’re officially on our last day in Paris. I’ve fallen in love with parts of this city, the food, the wine, and I’ve made some fantastic friends. I don’t regret leaving at this point. However, I’m still excited to return as a tourist to see more of Paris and France
There’s absolutely nothing wrong with being honest with yourself and moving on with your life. Happiness is something that we should all aspire to no matter where it may be: Paris or elsewhere.
So, tell me… Are you happy in Paris? What do you love/hate about Paris? What have I leave out or get wrong about being a Paris expat?
That said, this is NOT a typical article for this blog before you judge my entire blog based on this one article. I am much happier at home in the Netherlands.
If you’re looking for pragmatic, helpful, and honest tips for travel in Europe, you’re in the right place. If you want to read some more inspiring guides to Paris, click for an off the beaten path Paris guide and a guide to the covered passages in Paris.
Michelle
My friend moved to Paris for work (she’s fluent in French though) but I was shocked to learn that her hours were exactly the same as back home in Singapore (ending around midnight – 1am almost every day). Many people think of the much-vaunted 35-hour work week or whatever it is but the truth is, it’s a lot more complicated. Thanks for sharing!
Catherine
I have lived in Paris for almost 3 months..I am not happy with the vibe so far and the job market is horrendous but am hanging in there as my spouse is French but would not recommend living in Paris otherwise. Unless you are a student OR a person that receives an excellent job offer just avoid! I find the vibe a health hazard.
I hate Paris
Going on 4 years now here in Paris. Lastnight a valve poped and I just let out everything I’ve been bottling up. Unfortunatly that came out in the loudest screams possible directed at my pregnant wife. What has this city done to me to arrive being the angry guy yelling at his pregnant wife at 11PM?
It was a tough integration period – we lived in the ghetto ( la chappel), had no job and no grasp of French. Now I’m practically bi-lingual, working in my field, well paid and in a senior position.
But I just can’t gel with paris. It’s not the city, it’s the people. To accomplish anything beaurcratic is like squeezing blood from a stone. The people walk on the streets and don’t move, shoulder you and think they bought the street. Same goes for the metro and busses.
No one smiles, no one compliments – to the point I’ve visibly lost a lot of weight and shaped up and no one would tell me directly “oh you look good”, they’d just mention it in passing to my wife when not around… I don’t get it.
I can honestly say I hate paris, for the people – I can’t wait to leave. I’ve got it good here, probably better than the majority of ‘parisians’ yet the continual ass fucking you get whilst trying to acomplish anything and nothing in particular and how cold and assholish the parisians are is enough for me.
I’m gettiing the fuck out of this cesspol of negativity, constant judging, funny looks, agressiveness and the rest.
Word for the wise: if you’re thinking about coming to paris – think very very very very deeply.
Fuck Paris
paul
Bro Im french and couldnt agree more! Fuck these parisians . Would you be up for a meetup it’s rare to see people who share the same mindset.
Angelo
Arrived in Paris 8 years ago and still feeling lost til today. Things are feeling shaky maybe its time to go
*breathes deep*
Grasiela
I have been there too and hated it… The vibe is terrible and the people in its majority think they have ” a king in their bellies”… Hate it my partner lives there and his female business partner too and I can’t work so it was terrible situation to make it worse…
Grasiela
Arunima
My God!!!!!!!! I have so many things to say..the same as u say here. I had been suffering in silence and living an ‘invisible’ life in Paris for years (no-one sees me !!!). Never thought anybody else will share my sentiments. Before arriving I used to think ‘ I speak fluent French , I am smart , well-educated , I can make it ” ..boy was i wrong ! I have gained weight due to extreme isolation ,the insensitivity of people and due due to the shit atmosphere at work ( that is when I work !). When I wear a beautiful dress no-one talks to me that day at work . Bottom Line: Paris hates people.Parisians hate people. Come to Paris if you are a young student or retired but there are still better cities for the student and after-retirement experience .
beatrice
been living in paris for 9 years and though it was exciting at the start due to novelty, i can not stand it anymore: it is suffocating, everything feels old and antiquated. people are lethargic and depressed and i feel so isolated. i am planning to move to germany where it feels modern and uplifting and Clean! paris is toxic mentally and physically. macarons are ok thats about it really.
Sylflo
I am French and I really hate Paris also, I live currently for work but I am really hoping to live asap. My wife is Chinese, I live in Beijing for nine month and I can tell you Beijing is way way better than Paris.
Paris is really exhausting, fucking dirty, stressful and the people (especially the French) are most of the time fucking assholes and only think of themselves.
But I think it’s possible to enjoy Paris or during vacation or if you are really rich. But if you are from a middle class it’s place I would recommend to completely avoid
Ruffia
Germany is not any better go to Spain it’s way better
maurice
DUDE! I cant tell you how good it is for me to read this I have been here for about the same amount of time and like yourself have received a number of great job related successes
I got what I came for it really is wack. I wanted to write everything I felt about being here but you nailed it.
Thing is I’m not someone begging to be liked or fit in. Folks here are just on an island the size of texas stuck in a strange silence – time to move on even if I’ve become used to a comfort zone now its time to move on man .. wow..hahaa
Viv
My husband is french and we go back and forth all the time to Paris and other parts of France. For the record, they treat him poorly, too. They are odd with each other, not just expats. For instance, he asked someone at the airport where the train was and they gave him a hard time because he didn’t say Bonjour first. Another time, a hotel clerk would only speak in English to him because he married an American. My husband wasn’t even that fluent in English so it was doubly silly. The clerk would only speak to him in English, my husband never understood what he was saying so the American had to translate for the two French speakers. (Eye roll). Once his brother took my husband out for a drive in the country and left him there. My husband had to hitchhike back. It’s just a cold culture. Obviously, it gets better as you leave Paris, but I stand by my sentiment that France is a great place to visit but I wouldn’t want to live there.
AP
This made me laugh a lot hahaha!! A$s fu….g is sooooo correct!
Joëlle Wong
I resonated so much with your post. Thanks for sharing. The sad thing is… I speak French fluently and it’s not any better. I feel like I’ve really done my best…. Studied in France, practiced the language, got my CDI, earning a decent salary and I can’t manage to fulfill decent life goals like moving to a better apartment… Which is harder than getting a job.
I sense a lot of cultural tension in Paris and I wish the French could understand how their bureaucracy and ways of working creates such an unwelcoming and disrespectful environment for the people who are just doing their best to make a living here.
I’m really not sure if it will get better over time.
I really appreciated your post.
Emily
Don’t let the door hit you where the good Lord split you 😉
Thank you for posting this! My arrival in Paris was really tough and everywhere I turned everyone was acting like living in Paris was a dream and there was something wrong with me for having a hard time.
After 8 years I love Paris, but I think I would love anyplace I chose to live in for that long. But when people tell me they have just arrived I want to give them a big hug and tell them “It gets better”. Then slap them across the face to prepare them for living here.
Carlos
Hi…I get encouraged to move to Paris when I hear and in the long run all gets better….one thing I would like to know more is about race and and age dismrimination. I think an honest desire to learning the French language would make any struggle easier
I.
Lived in Paris almost 5 years as a biracial woman (African/Caucasian). I was constantly mistaken for an Arab woman, and mocked for, in their biased eyes, pretending to be a Christian (which I am born and raised). I also come from an educated middle class, which seemed impossible for them to understand or believe. Since their unbearable hate for that ethnic group and their main religion is real, I got bullied basically everyday and discriminated daily basis in any place. From my looks they seemed to feel entitled to treat me like a threat or a ruthless immoral person ready to do something wrong. I had never felt this anywhere in the world, and it did give me a stress disorder and depression. I was also expatriated with my husband and managed to work, as I speak fluent French. Other than that, the city is vibrant with talented people, arts, cultural events, fine cuisine and beautiful sight-seeings –
in the banlieues as well. The work environment and conditions are good but – among Parisians – quite prone to indirect bullying (so they feel sadistically satisfied but leave no evidence for complaints). We ended up leaving as we wanted to feel safe and healthier in another place. Overall, Paris is worth it if you are thick-skinned.
Chrys Hemissi
I love this! So funny!, I’ve only been here for a month and I’m wishing someone slapped beforehand!
Emily
As far as the job market here, it is tough. There are A LOT of highly educated people competing for low paying English teaching jobs. If I wanted to be a teacher or work with kids, or had any talent for that, I think I would have noticed before I moved to Paris.
I didn’t go to college, so I worked my way up to a well paying office job in the US. It is not that I am “above” being a waitress. But expecting me to be happy doing that after paying my dues and getting to the point where I had skills beyond that felt like going backwards.
I don’t blame you for not wanting to sit around hoping that your French would improve and that a well paying job would open up in your field here eventually. Good for you for realizing it wasn’t worth it, wasn’t working, and finding something that would.
Megan
I think it is brave to put your thoughts down in a post and I admire you for doing so. Too many people only talk about the good points of being an expat and often shun letting people know that at times, it can be freaking hard. Not every city is meant for every person. When I first moved abroad, I hated Bergen, Norway. Visiting there was awesome, but living there?! Hell no. Just like what you said, visiting and living in a place is different. I later traveled to Oslo and hated it. Then I randomly moved there on a whim and LOVED it. Everyone’s story is different. I think so many expats get caught up in comparison games with everyone else instead of acknowledging that not everyone’s experience is the same. I know people who love living in Germany and have had no issue w/ the visa office. That is not my story. Paris IS a great place to live for some people… you’re just not one of them and there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with that.
PS: Germans refrain from picking up dog poo too. I’m tempted to make an instructional video and have it ready to hand out when I see someone not doing it 😛
Charmaine
I love how you touched on the bureaucracy! That is a pain. I came with a PROPER job from the Ministry of EDUCATION teaching English and I still struggled. No one was there to help. They gave me the stuff I needed and told me to go to the offices and deal with it. Of course, the people in the office was not helpful AT ALL. They just told me to wait or to go to another office and my French was terrible as well. I just had to keep pushing words out of a dictionary until people GET me and thank god they did but it’s almost hopeless. I lived there for 8.5 years and I try to avoid the topic of “Ohh.. how was PARIS?” I wish that I got to see the city (as a visit) rather than living there because now I can never go back and see how WONDERFUL it can be. How long were you there? I’m glad you expressed your frustrations because I GET IT. Where will you head to next? Best of luck!
Grace
Hey Charmaine,
I am looking at teaching in English in Paris (which a couple people have mentioned is competitive/difficult). I have a masters in English and a masters in Education though. Do you have any advice on how to move forward? How did you get your job through the Ministry of Education?
Happy you are somewhere new now, hopefully less emotionally taxing.
-Grace
Sonia Pereira de Figueiredo
Karen, I lived in Paris for a year and a half and I had exact the same experience and I was living on a room with my daughter just like you and your hubby…I had all my UN paperwork and still didn’t get the ‘dossier’ for a proper house because I was not working in Paris, I was just willing to spend my money!! I could add some things but you have in a short period of time pretty much said it all! Plus clients are NEVER F***ing right arghh and I am fluent in French! Plus the dog poop thing!!!People would look to us in disgust for picking up after our dog, for realzzz!!!
chris
This was a very funny post. I visited Paris numerous times and I am good for about a week, then I know it is time to leave. Paris is Not a “living” place, it is a point in time. I dream of living there, but the cheap that comes with it is beneath me. I don’t have the millions it would take for me to carve the life I would want, so I’m content to be a vister and leave. I generally find that to be the case in most places. I guess they like dog shit?
P.S.
I studied IB French as a kid, more French in college, graduate degree from HEC, in laws are French , and I too am over it. I love it from a far far place.
Rebecca
I’m so glad to read this post – someone digging deep and being honest about the realities of being an expat abroad.
I’m an expat in Greece – luckily I like it/love it…but there are the same frustrations re: bureaucracy and the dog poo (I’m glad someone else commented here that Germany has the same issue there).
I’ve heard so many stories of French bureaucracy and to be honest, I think it’s a national pastime, in their DNA to be awkward (I may get backlash for saying that!)
But truly; good on you for being honest. Too much blogging and travel posts are about how ‘great everything is’ and yes, whilst we do recognise that we’re privileged to travel, we’re not always going to be happy in the places we end up.
I wish you well.
Joy
First of all, it’s not so easy and glamorous to be an expat no matter where you live. London is our fourth city in 7 years and the first place I’m able to work, but it’s still not easy. I understand. I love taking the Eurostar to visit Paris, but I would expect living there to be entirely different like you said. Same in London. I like living here, but i don’t like the crowds, the tourists, the stupid bureaucracy, how expensive it is and how totally British the Brits can be sometimes! 😉
Best of luck wherever you end up next!
Tracy
I laughed out loud when I read about your horror over the dog poop everywhere. Absolutely. I’ve been here for 3 years and I can validate all your complaints. I however love Paris and feel like its home, so I’m dealing with the “issues”.
It was so tough in the beginning, though and then it got better. Its your choice not to give it more time, but Paris takes more than a couple months to get used to.
I’m sorry you have been so unhappy, thanks for being honest, and best of luck in your next home.
Chris (not Christophe)
Hi Karen,
I love this post. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
The following notes are as much for others looking to make the most of their expat experience, as much as being a response to yourself. Please indulge me 😉
Although I’ve only been to Paris a few times, I’ve been in Lyon for 2 years and was in Brussels for 3 years before that and your experiences resonate on a few levels.
I’m the trailing spouse in our family and – with the missus working long hours and me looking after the kids but having developed little French (possibly B1/2 level) – it has been a tough row to hoe.
While we were totally blessed with my wife’s work paying for a relocation agent in each instance, it was *still* tough (while Belgian bureaucracy wasn’t as nightmarish as the French, just horrendous) and I don’t envy anyone going through the abstractions and inconsistencies of that special kind of hell. Get help.
That said, I’m extremely grateful for the people – expats and locals alike – who have been willing to help us, out of the goodness of their hearts. I subscribe to an expat maxim of “pay it forward” – if you see someone who’s obviously new – even in the supermarket – and you can help, then do it! Karen, you touched on people responding as armchair psychologists (i.e. don’t), so suffice it to say that I know that depression is a real thing for expats, so they need to be proactive and get help.
If moving to France or Belgium and looking to continue an office-based career without having a role secured beforehand, I can only say to do your work as an independant / external consultant. As you outlined Karen, the job market is tough, even separate from any consideration of visas and language. Seek professional advice on doing this – there are expat advisors around. Get help.
Anyway, there’s a recurring theme. If you know of any resources to draw on for navigating the vagaries and pressures of expat life – suck the marrow from it! Enjoy the good parts of expat life (there are many) but don’t be proud/ignorant/stupid about how to make life easier and better.
That said, sometimes life in a particular place just doesn’t click. Karen, I’m sure you’ve been asked this – and I don’t mean to “teach you to suck eggs” – but I’m interested to know if had you considered Lyon? The easy TGV ride goes between the two cities in less than two hours. While not as picture-postcard perfect as Paris it is still quite lovely, it’s much cheaper, the food and wine are even better, and the people aren’t too bad, either… 😉
Again, thanks for your post. I’ve now subscribed and look forward to reading more of your adventures!
Veronique
I was just looking at the date of this article, it’s only a couple of days ago! I have moved to paris a couple of weeks back, and I think I am still on the pink cloud of living in Paris (and in love :)) Though I *completely* agree with you on all the things you’ve wrote. The level of bureaucracy is insane. I come from the Netherlands and my French boyfriend couldn’t believe his eys when I walked into the municipality to pick up my passport, put in my date of birth, go re-directed to the right person and was out in less than 5 minutes. Bureaucracy, not being efficient and oh boy don’t even get me started on the landlords. After we finally found a home for a rental price equal to that of a kidney on the black market, we didn’t have a window in our living room for four weeks. It’s insane, and as Dutch person (I like to think of myself being pretty efficient) it drives me nuts. I still love Paris, but with just a little effort it could be so much better. Just be open to other things. This is 2017, not everybody speaks french, make an effort to either talk slower or explain in less complicated words. I have booked an appointment at a hairdresser who got irritated after 1 minute (and I speak a decent word of French, I’d say level B2) because I don’t know all the terms yet: balayage? Is that the same as in english, ombre is that not a balayage, and what exactly is a pantine…. I have no idea because he talked SO fast…. So I guess I’ll see what it looks like on Thursday. Oh and if I can rant about one thing…. Social! Anything social just doesnt exist! When we first moved in I introduced myself to our neighbour on the same floor, who now probably has the idea that I want to hook up, because “we don’t introduce ourselves here”. I.e. you could be living on the same floor as someone for years and not know them…. So weird! During our move the door flew shut due to the wind, we had to ring the door at another neighbour to ask if we could use the phone. She opened the door, let us call, took the phone back and closed the door. I told my boyfriend that if that happened to me, I would let the people in, have a coffee and a chat, I mean it’s cold and you’re standing in the hallway and you live in the same building right? Nope! Not here. You mind your own business. That’s a big thing I just don’t understand. Anyway: I hope you will find a nice new place to live in in a nice city and think back of your Paris experience as another life lesson on what makes you happy!
Karen
Hi Veronique,
Funnily enough we’re moving back to the Netherlands 😉 Your post made me laugh a little especially about the apartment.
I had actually a really funny experience in an old building in Amsterdam. As an American it’s a bit weird to be so friendly with your neighbors beyond saying hi (when you feel like it). As a result, I never was very careful about really greeting my neighbors, just the ones that I liked/knew well. Anyways, my one neighbor was horribly offended by my husband not always greeting him and wrote me a long note. We went back and forth with notes on the door (as I didn’t feel comfortable knocking on a neighbor’s door expecting them to be free without knowing their schedule) before he told me that it was rude that we communicated through notes. Anyways in the end, I invited him for coffee and we had a good relationship going forward. It’s funny how cultural differences dictate such different neighbor behavior. 😉
I would not know the difference between those terms in English…so I hope that your hair turns out okay. I thought balayage was similar to ombre….but oops.
Hopefully paris becomes warmer and your neighbor relationships improve just a little. 😉
Marguerite
Hi Karen, thanks for sharing! This post echoes a lot of what I’ve gone through in Germany, especially the job situation and not speaking the language fluently. Sometimes the braver decision really is to call a spade a spade and work towards finding a better fit! Wishing you all the best back in the Netherlands, from one expat to another.
Toni
I think you’re brave for being honest. I love Paris and have spent a lot of time there and have learned French for it, I love it so. BUT- living long term somewhere is a whole different ballgame. People don’t often think about the bureaucracy and how long it takes to get stuff done there and how expensive it is- because it is! I still love it, but like all cities, it has a dark side too. I like what you said and my advice I would add is before you think moving to Paris is a fairytale, research it as thoroughly as possible, talk to others who have spent a lot of time there and lived there and find out about the bureaucracy and what it takes to work there, get a place to live, etc. Just like you did. I tell people frequently that it’s one of the worst things you can do, move somewhere or go for an extended time thinking only of the fairytale aspect. It’s a setup for massive struggle and disappointment, when it’s already difficult enough. Be realistic. Thank you for your awesome post and honesty!❤️
Rebecca
I loved this post! As a real francophile ( for the past 16 years I have spent a couple of months every summer in the south ) every one always assumes that I LOVE Paris. I hate Paris, and spend as little time there as possible. And while I know some of the issues remain country-wide (the bureaucracy!) somehow they are just magnified in Paris. Sort of like NYC. I live here because of my job, and when I finally moved here for work, I thought it would amazing…parties, fabulous people and amazing clothes. Nothing could be farther from the truth. It’s filthy, it’s noisy, it’s expensive and it will grind you down. So, I hear ‘ya! I am glad you are going back to a place that feels like home to you! Life is just too short.
Linda
Thanks very much for your story and insights about living in Paris. I went through a similar experience when I moved to Japan many years ago without Japanese language skills or an understanding of how different cultures can be from one another. I ended up staying in Japan for 16 years and learning Japanese. Then I went to Hong Kong where most everyone in the business world speaks English, so at least there was not much language pressure. After 16 years in Hong Kong, I left and moved to rural France in 2013. My high school French is much better than a few years ago and, unlike Paris, the people here are very patient with my efforts and mistakes. I have kind and helpful French neighbors and have met other Americans and some lovely Brits who are fun and supportive. There’s even an Indian restaurant not far away, so it isn’t totally monocultural here.
I’ve been an expat for over 30 years and am now a permanent immigrant in France – I’ll never move back to the US. But – I live in the countryside in Normandy with access to Paris in two hours by car or train. It’s great to be surrounded by nature and the life here is far different from the one in Paris. I go to Paris now and then to see clients or visit an exhibition and I’m always so glad to get home to my little farm and my animals. I’m at a different stage of life than you but can understand how frustrating it would be not to be able to work. I’m no longer full-time in the corporate world and, fortunately, my work is portable and I work mainly by phone, WebEx and Zoom.
Being an expat / immigrant is never simple or easy and people who’ve never done it underestimate the efforts involved and the toll it takes. But, being a global nomad has some wonderful upsides too. Enjoy your new life in the Netherlands and, if you ever come back to France, try life in the countryside.
Lesley
Good on you for realizing that Parisian life isn’t for you. It’s definitely different than other big cities around the world. Even the French don’t like Paris. Parisians complain about everything! I feel you on the challenges of living here without a job, being dependent on your significant other, all while coping with depression because of your living situation. I’ve been in France for 2 years (1 in Paris) and still trying to find work. Anyway, I wish you luck on your next jouney in life. Thanks for sharing your story.
CAMPBELL
Oh man I can agree with pretty much all of this. Although I have not been in Paris, I was in Toulouse and now in another city in France. I’ve been abroad for the past 10 years, but my 5 years in France have definitely been the hardest and I speak fluent French. I never actually wanted to live in France but I fell in love with a Frenchman. I can’t even begin to go into all the details of how difficult it has been but the main problem has been working here. I have a Masters degree from a European Uni and still find things incredibly difficult. Among the beaurocratic problems, I do not like the outright judging of people (gets even worse when you have kids) and there are so few parks and green spaces that are walkable from the city. I have to say that I am so thankful I was in Toulouse and not Paris for that also. What I do love is the food, wine, social and cultural programs and going on holiday can sometimes be just an hour or two drive away. But I continually ask myself, is that all worth your soul?
John
I’m a “professional expat” who lived in France for 8 years – first in Orleans and then in Paris attending The Sorbonne where I attained my M.F.A. Granted, it was way back in the 1960’s but the attitudes of the Parisians hasn’t changed that much since then as I’ve been back many times since. What one has to remember is that Parisians hate EVERYONE that isn’t a long-time Parisian. They even hate other French from everywhere else in France. Parisians are spoiled little brats, arrogant, enabled and intolerant of any one but themselves. It even gets to the point where different sections of Paris don’t like those from other sections. The best advice is to locate in a small village or town on the outskirts of Paris where people are more friendly and tolerant of others. I loved Paris but strongly disliked Parisians themselves.
I had a professor that had left Paris to teach in Switzerland and he told me that when he came back after 4 years that he hated the people he once knew because they had determined he had deserted the “class” of people he once had as friends. He was treated as an outsider for years after he returned.
Another suggestion I strongly advise anyone thinking about living in Paris is to throw away all your clothes and buy everything in the Paris flea markets. Your clothes will not only look typical Parisian but will smell like it as well (not a bad thing but just different). Once you have that accomplished, you need to take up learning Paris “street French/slang” that will help disguise the fact that you are NOT a long-time Parisian. I learned both those lessons early on and adapted myself as quickly as possible and had no problems from that point on.
By the way, I speak, read and write French fluently. Still dream in French from time to time.
Have also lived and worked in Saudi Arabia for over 2 decades and living in Paris is a cakewalk in comparison.
Kate
I think it is absolutely incredible that you’re sharing your truth Karen. All too often, bloggers only talk about the positives in travel and living abroad which is so unrealistic. People expect such famous places to be just as magical as they are portrayed in the media, but that is simply not always true. I expected Paris to be a place that I would fall in love with; the architecture, the pastries, the atmosphere and all… But although the landmarks were absolutely breathtaking, the city itself left me very underwhelmed. There’s NOTHING wrong with telling your perspective of a destination. It’s healthy, so ignore the haters! Let’s make the blogging community a positive, honest place XXX
Liza
I love Paris and would love to try living there at some point. However, I could relate to your post on so many levels – just change Paris to Amsterdam!
I really liked Amsterdam the first time I came here as a tourist. It’s picturesque and fun – what’s not to love?
Then last year we found ourselves in a situation where we had to go from living full-time in London (my favourite city ever and our home for the last six years) to spending almost half of our time in Amsterdam (thanks, Brexit). We rented a lovely apartment in a lovely neighbourhood, but suddenly Amsterdam just lost its charm. I obviously still enjoyed many things about the city – the incredible architecture, the cycling, the flowers, the Musemkaart, the many nice restaurants, trips to Keukenhof, you name it – but these were almost overshadowed by the things that I disliked: it’s quite expensive, it’s not a great city for walking, there seem to be a lot of smokers around, the weather leaves a lot to be desired even for someone who grew up in a Nordic country, the cultural agenda looks practically empty when compared to that of London.. I could go on.
I had to make a conscious effort to simply start ignoring the negatives and focusing on the positives, and this has actually worked: Amsterdam still isn’t necessarily in the top-10 of the cities that I would like to live in, even part-time, but it’s probably in the top-15 and making its way up the list as we speak 🙂 I’m starting to like it more and more, and, now that I’m here, I’m willing to make the most of it.
That being said, if you have the option of moving from a city that you’re not crazy about back into a city that you really like, why wouldn’t you take it, and why wouldn’t you be honest about it? Hope you’re move back goes well, and thank you for a thought-provoking post!
Lucy
This spoke to me so much! I’ve just been a trailing spouse (Is that what you called it?!) while my other half was on a dance scholarship in LA. I wanted to love it – and thought I would – but was pretty miserable for most of the time. It’s hard when people have such unrealistic views of cities – LA for the glamour, Paris for the romance – as they very rarely live up to expectation! xo
Leigh
Really interesting perspective – I love reading the good and the bad about a place as it seems more realistic. As travelers, I think we’re hard on ourselves to love every place but it’s also important to remember that almost 1/2 of Americans have never lived anywhere but the state they grew up in. Moving to a new country is incredibly adventurous, something that probably goes unacknowledged in the expat community.
That said, I feel like a lot of these points (dog poop!) apply to many cities. I always said Chicago is a great city to visit, but living there, spending 3 hours a day commuting, is not so great.
Kendra Bodman
I love this and appreciate the honestly. I just moved to Oslo and absolutely hated it, despite the great things I had heard about Norway. And now I’m leaving.
Sherrie
I can totally relate to this. We only spent 48 hours in Paris, but I knew right away that this was not the city for me. I’m glad I got to visit, it has so many beautiful buildings and landmarks, but it didn’t capture me the way London or New York did. I felt bad admitting that. It seems as though Paris is a place everybody with a brain should love, so it was refreshing to see your post and realize I’m not the only one enamored with the place 🙂
Erin
We’re on our second International move, now in Germany. Requiring local qualifications is huge here, so it’s probably best you didn’t go for Berlin as you were musing about in the FTB group. I’ve heard French bureaucracy is a particular nightmare, it wasn’t a picnic here or in the UK. Those first 4 months or so are full to the brim with that stuff. Again, in Germany, finding work is very difficult without fluent German, unless you come here with a job offer in hand. You’re very lucky to be able to leave so quickly – most people who move with work have at least 1-2 years to do or risk paying back the relocation package of 50-60k€ at a minimum. Sounds like you were able to get back to a place you’re happy, so that’s good.
Karen
Hi Erin, Thanks for your comment. I wonder how Berlin would have been, but maybe I’ll find out soon. That’s interesting to know about Germany.
I know we were very lucky to leave quickly. We didn’t get a typical expat relocation package, so leaving after a short time was possible as the company didn’t pay for our move. If it had not been, I’m sure that we would have stayed for a while and maybe it would have improved. A good friend of mine had this with a job and was forced to stay at least three years as a result.
Appreciate it. 🙂
Faith Coates
I really enjoyed reading this piece and as an expat I can see exactly where you are coming from. I haven’t even been to Paris yet but I am longing to go as a tourist because I know my french (from Montreal) will never be good enough. I also have experienced the expat syndrome in Spain and had the same kinds of issues there. So I have decided that Ireland is my expat “home” for many of the reasons you spoke about. I also think Amsterdam is a brilliant city and would settle there personally just because I love the people and the country so much.
Sheree
I’m not an expat and I’ve not spent a great deal of time in Paris, so I’m not sure I’m fulfilling your mandate of using the comments to tell you what I really think about that experience 😉 I’m simply here to say GOOD ON YOU for sharing your thoughts. I can tell how much time and effort and deliberation went into crafting this essay, you’ve clearly done a lot of soul searching in reaching this point, and I think you’ve been very fair and balanced in your approach. I’m really glad you’re moving on to chase your bliss elsewhere (life is too short, and every other hippie platitude you can imagine) – I’ve got my fingers crossed for you that your next experience is a more positive one for you 😉 Thank you SO much for sharing this! A great reminder to be open and honest about your feelings, especially when “the dream” isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.
Susan
Life’s too short to live someone else’s dream.
Good for you to decide what is right for you and act on it rather than wasting your precious time.
I lived in Paris years ago as a student and so avoided much of the bureaucracy but knew it would never be home because I was an ocean away from my family and the language barrier would be a permanent wall between my family and any French family I might have joined. Nevermind the smoking, casual sexism, and permanent lower status of non-natives.
People who haven’t lived in a place (even if they have visited it) never will fully understand, so their opinions frankly are off base.
Like you, I love to visit (now with my American husband and kids). France is stunningly beautiful, endlessly charming, of unparalleled class and culture. Paris and so much more. We don’t have to be French or live in France to enjoy her.
Good luck re-integrating home (if indeed that is where you are going). I found re-entry much harder than adjusting to life abroad.
Rajlakshmi
I love the honesty in your post and the fact that you provided a completely different picture of Paris. I agree that living in a place is whole different experience than visiting it for a short time. I am sorry you have to deal with this. Specially with work. I am an expat (not in Paris), and it does get very frustrating when you want to work but can’t find one without any fault of yours. The competition in market is unfortunately something that is beyond our control. I wish you well 🙂
Amy Poulton
Hey Karen,
This really resonated and I want to thank you for sharing such an honest perspective. I had a similar experience living in Sicily, Italy. I *love* Italy and lived in the north for four months before moving down to the island. But – exactly how you say: living somewhere is totally different to visiting; there are logistical things that you can’t know until you physically arrive and attempt to build a life there; plus, sometimes a place just isn’t for you, or isn’t for you at that time in your life.
When I tried to talk to friends back home about how miserable I was in Catania, I got some very cold responses. One of my best friends actually stopped speaking to me for a while. I too am aware that being an expat is a privilege, but that doesn’t mean that I should pretend that my life is perfect when it isn’t. Those cold responses from friends made me feel even more isolated at a time when I already felt alone.
However, the silver lining is now I know better and the experience taught me the things I should look for in a place before I move there and the personal things I need in a home in order to be happy there. Those are invaluable lessons. What’s great is that I now look back on those three months in Sicily fondly and I’m still in touch with all the friends I made there. Everything happens for a reason – there’s a lesson to be learnt in every challenge.
Wishing you the best with your move!
Esther
France is great to visit as a TOURIST.
Living there is a whole different story.
Emily Hines
I’m glad to read your story Karen. I visited Paris for a few weeks before when I was quite young. I did enjoy my time there but I was with my fluent speaking aunt so we got around with ease. I will say I experienced a similar experience when I lived in Hawaii for a few years. I really did love it there but it was absolutely brutal at times. Living somewhere totally new, especially a foreign country is always tough and not feeling like you can talk openly about your struggles. I look forward to reading more about your experience in Paris and good luck in your move!
Crazy Travelista
I love how raw and honest you were. It’s definitely not as glamorous to live somewhere as it is to visit. I’m honestly not a fan of Paris and I actually had a horrible time there. The people there were downright nasty to me and ruined my time there. It sucks that such a beautiful city had to be ruined by mean people. But I like to remain open minded and maybe give Paris another shot one day…now that I have thicker skin 🙂
Francesca Murray
I’m glad you had the courage to tell your truth, even if others may not like it. It is your blog after all 😉
I have lived in France and dealt with the bureaucracy and I know it can be a pain. I just happen to be one of those francophiles that is so in love with France that I just remind myself why it’s worth it. I can’t imagine going through it all without those feelings to keep you going, yikes!
Also, unfortunately the language thing just is what it is. I totally sympathize with the fact that moving to France was somewhat of a quick decision as opposed to something pre-planned along your life’s journey, hence the reason you aren’t fluent. Given all the circumstances the best thing to do was probably not live there anymore, so good for you! Wishing you the best on the rest of your journey!
Edith de Belleville
Dear Karen,
.I can understand that you don’t like Paris.But how can you prétend to be a Paris expert after living only 2 months? since when you are an expat after spending 2 months in à country ?.You are excellent in marketing for sure….
Karen
Hi Edith,
Thank you for your delightful comment and your complimentary words about my marketing skills. 🙂
According to the Merriam Webster dictionary, an expatriate (often shortened to expat) means to leave one’s native country to live elsewhere. That is exactly what I did several years ago when I left the US and what I did when we moved to France legally. However, I see that my experiences in Paris aren’t sufficiently good enough for you. That’s fine and you’re welcome to your own opinion.
Best,
Karen
Cherene Saradar
I can see how it would be a tough city to break into, especially with the language barrier. Language is a really big separator. I felt this way in MY OWN country in Miami believe it or not. I tried to live in NYC for 6 months and couldn’t take it, even though I LOVE visiting NYC. It seems like Paris for you and other may be that kind of city. One to visit but not to live in.
Caitlin
I love that you’ve written this. I fully understand your points and I have very similar feelings about my time living in Prague. It’s difficult when you live somewhere so fabulous and you’re made to feel ungrateful for not liking it. But you’re not wrong and my mom told me, you don’t have to love everywhere. And I think the best decision you can make is just to go, don’t become bitter towards the place. So I hope wherever you’re off to next is a million times better!!
Joy Mars
Seems like this article is clickbait. Everyone has complaints about where they live, but in this case Paris makes it a headline. Anything for digital attention, eh blogger?
monica
If that’s what you think, then you must either be one of those blind people who think that Paris is a dream place to live in, or just a hater who is jealous of the amount of attention generated by this post.
Karen
I hope you consider looking at some of my other articles as I generally don’t publish things like this. I generally post useful and inspiring travel tips with nice photos and I’ll have some lovely articles about France next month. I encourage you not to rush to judgment about me, but you’re entitled to your own opinion of course.
Monica
I wish I had met you when you were still living in Paris!!! I am probably the expat world-champion when it comes to complaining about Paris life….
Unlike you though, I have absolutely no problem pointing out that I utterly dislike the city, and why. In general, people think it’s funny and refreshing to find someone who doesn’t think this stupid city is a dream to live in… 🙂
To make a long story short, Paris is a very dirty place, it is overpopulated, obscenely expensive, and I won’t even mention the creeps that follow you or twho think they are entitled to grope your bum in public transportation.
When I see some Instagram accounts dedicated to food/wine/old buildings in Paris, I feel sick. I wonder if these people are blind or if they are all spoiled golden boys/girls who can afford to live in elegant apartments near the Eiffel Tower, and whose only occupation is to go out for brunch or drinks in fancy places.
My experience is very different from theirs and I am so ready to leave.
Thanks for sharing your experience and kudos for moving to a better place!
Philly
Hi,
I just read your post and I would like to comment on it.
First of all, I think I know what it’s like to be an Expat: I am a European who lived for quite a while in the United States.
You might not want to hear that (you mentioned that right at the beginning and at the end of your post) but I think you did give up too soon. There is something that is called the “Cultural Adjustment Curve”: After only two months you’re usually in the frustration-phase (you find everything terrible and think moving was a big mistake). You also think that it will never get better – but usually it will. It just takes some time. You have to overcome that phase in order for things to get better. For me it was the same. The first 3 months I hated everything in the US: big things (like American politics) and small things (e.g. that Americans talk so fucking loud – reminded me of your complaint about the dog poop). But you get used to these things. And at some point it’s as good or bad as living at home (in your case: the US).
About your job situation: I can imagine that this must have been a terrible situation and I am someone who doesn’t like being dependent on anybody. So, I can completely understand that this was very difficult – in addition to adjusting to another culture. However, I can’t really believe that even though you did research on this topic, you honestly thought you could get a job in Paris (or anywhere in France for that matter) without being fluent in French. I have never lived in France and I haven’t done any research on this topic but even I could have told you that this could never work. The only case, in which this would have been possible is if you work (e.g. as a freelancer) for a company abroad – but I would think that even that might be a difficult undertaking.
I don’t want to affront you or make you feel bad but it seems to me as if you were a little bit naive.
I wish you all the best in the future!
Karen
Hi Philly,
I do know the cultural adjustment curve, but we had some ugly practical realities that limited our time in France before the move. I wish we had a bit more time to adjust before we left, but it is what it is.
Keep in mind that my partner got a job in France without any French as a skilled professional and we know others in a similar situation. I should say that we had a quick decision between two very difficult places and Paris was actually the better place in terms of job prospects/cost of living if you can believe that.
That said, I do think freelancing online or having your own business is a very good option for those moving to France with working rights. It really seems to be the main way that most expats I met in France get by.
Anyways, thanks for sharing your experiences. I’ve been so curious how some of my European friends would fare in the US work environment. I think the attitude towards vacation time in the US is the bit that always seems to shock them the most when they hear about US working culture, but I’m curious if that was your experience as well.
We’re happy now and that’s what matters to me. 😉 Merry Christmas!
Catgerine
I study French in Paris And many many expatriates work here without French language
Catherine C
Hello Karen…please feel free to reply here as I recently relocated from Texas to Paris and you can imagine my dilemma when I am accustomed to southern hospitality!
Best of luck
D
Karen
Hi Catherine,
I really hope things get better. I SO recommend the Grumpy Expat group for finding awesome people (and having a safe space to complain).
I think my feeling here are very clear (and honest) although I honestly hope that things improve for you very soon. It’s really tough looking for a job after you’ve moved to a new place. Remember that if your spouse is French, you two get the ability to move elsewhere in the EU where it might be a bit better for you work-wise as Paris is a tough job market.. especially if you’re not fluent. If you need any inspiration, feel free to check my posts about expat life in the Netherlands (where we’ve moved since Paris).
I’m a New Yorker myself, so the southern hospitality thing was actually quite foreign to me at first, but I’ve grown quite accustomed to it. 😉 Just be sure to ALWAYS greet people when you enter a shop in Paris. It feels just a little American in that way although Paris reminds me more of New York than another city that I’ve known.
Sorry for the slow response and merry christmas! 🙂
Best,
Karen
Alberto
I agree with the above. You gave up to soon. I’m a Belgian expat in Canada (now a permanent resident) and all of what you mentioned is virtually the same for most countries. Most employers are a reluctant to hire expats for the simple reason that most of them either have/will have visa issues or just leave after a few months. Usually when you arrive in a new country you should get a job that is probably “below” your skill level. However, once employers see that you have lived for a year or so in the country, and even better if you managed to get a permanent residency everything becomes much easier (it was for me).
Also, the truth is that the Netherlands, Belgium and maybe Sweden are probably the only countries in continental Europe where you can find fairly easily a well paid English only job. Outside of those countries I would say that you need to fluent in the respective nations language in-order to find a reasonably well paid job.
I would like to give a bit of advice for Americans regarding the job search and culture in Europe in general (I’m a Belgian that lives in Canada so I have a bit of an understanding of both job cultures and their differences). What you need to understand is that in France it is extremely difficult for an employer to fire you. As such, they are less likely to hire you. They won’t just “give you a shot” since they can’t fire you if things don’t work out for them after a very short probation period (and sometimes none). When they are hiring you you have to look in their eyes flawless. Now this might sound very discouraging but it is very normal to look months or even a year or two for an adequate job. However, once you are hired you’re in, you are extremely hard to fire and it’s very hard for them to renegotiate the terms of the contract. And don’t forget the conditions, at least 5 weeks of paid holidays (on average 8 weeks), sick leave with pay, a 35 hour work week, and if you do overtime, every hour of overtime means an extra hour of free time off, so this means that if you work a 39 hour work week you’ll get another 22 days extra besides the 5 or more weeks you already had.
What I would suggest you to do is rent a cheap studio in a suburb of Paris and get a simple job asap in-order to pay the bills. Try to work towards a permanent visa, improve your french and maybe get a french degree as well since it’s dirt cheap to study in France (always helps to have a native degree).
Pamela
I was born there and frankly, I’m leaving again. Stayed for months trying to get “back in” and basically got treated like either a “visitor” a “tourist” or an “immigrant.” I couldn’t even afford to get out of the Airport to go to a Mairie or a CCAS or anything like that to get “settled in.” I know I was a “mistake” to be born in the first place, let alone THERE. But that’s why my father insisted that I NOT be raised there, by my mother. I see why now. It is probably better to be “French” somewhere else in the world.
Evelyn
How you feel about Paris is how I felt living in the Bahamas! I couldn’t get a job there, it was really expensive and was not metropolitan. To this day people judge me because I didnt like it and keep telling me how lucky I was to live there and make me feel like a brat because I didnt like it. I wasn’t on holiday I lived there it makes a difference. I know whats its like to be a grumpy expat! thanks for sharing and I’m so glad you are somewhere where YOU are happy.
catrin
Well, obviously you had to leave if it felt so wrong. Generally in two months you get nothing done here. Especially if you are non-EU. You could have learned to relaaaaxxx, and learn french properly. 😀 and have good time in museums and enjoying culture. It’s so funny and unlogical that even when nothing works I still love to be here. ! I did not knew a person in Paris, either spoke any word of French but I get constantly compliments about my language 😀 no logic, no! But. Wish you great luck in Amsterdam, it’s my second favourite city!
Saint
Who doesn’t love Paris? I’ve been here 5 years now and have never been happier. My aunt left me a lovely apartment overlooking Parc —– and just the view each morning lifts my spirits. My main concern is that I don’t speak French and communicating with our Algerian maid is a nightmare. ( and I think she might be stealing). As far as food being expensive, it really isn’t and certainly fresh flowers every week is doable for everyone.
(Edited by admin to protect reader privacy. Kind reminder: Don’t include private information that gives away your address.)
meish
Seriously? You live in an apartment that has been given to you. So I assume you dont pay rent and you have a lovely place to live.
On top of that you have a maid. So I’m assuming you have a very comfortable level of life..
Most people dont live in a a lovely apartment overlooking Parc Monceau and have maids. Most people are struggling to make ends meet and on top of that have to deal with endless bureaucracy and rude people.
Sorry but I dont think you can quite relate to what most people are referring to on this page.
Guy
Hi.
Just read this post. I’m french living in Paris and loving and hating this town sometimes in the same minute.
While reading I was quit amazed that you could had felt guilt for not loving Paris. This city can be “violent” in this way to meet expats. To be honest if I had to imagine me in the shoes of an american expats there is more chances that I hate the city rather than love it. Paris is tough.
In fact your post is really well balanced, and there is actually no reason to feel guilt for not loving the city.
Daan
I’d have to agree with the author. I’ve been living here for more than a year now and I just don’t like it here. The wages are low, taxes high and nobody speaks with you if you’re not a fluent French speaker. Furthermore, the French would rather drop dead before they’ll speak English. And don’t you dare criticise their shockingly bad public services! Honestly, the only good thing around here are the bakeries.
All in all, a garbage country filled with garbage people.
Marina
Wow! That’s quite an attitude. Yeah, you should definitely leave if you have such a terrible view of Paris/France.
I don’t speak French but found people still very nice and they usually try to help whenever I’m here.
If you weren’t so insulting towards the end I might have been more understanding but it also again could be an attitude thing. I mean “All in all, a garbage country filled with garbage people.” ?
Billie
I, too, found the comments pretty sad to read. I moved to Paris just over a year ago and have found Parisian people very delightful. Understanding that my situation is unique to all the others in that I am retired and living in a really wonderful part of Paris which doesn’t have much dog poop on the sidewalks. There have been times when it’s been difficult but I have several French friends with whom I get together and they are from all walks of life. Yes, the language barrier is the most difficult and while I probably should have spent the first months learning the language I chose instead to focus on my home and making a home because I lost my home in the US in the Santa Rosa, California fire. I think anyone pulling up stakes and moving to another country faces many obstacles, primarily cultural ones, but with perseverance any obstacle can be overcome. This is just my Pollyanna view of life. I hope this fellow finds a place to his liking as obviously Paris is not it.
Mary
Hi Billie,
I’m so sorry you lost your home in the fire, but happy you’ve made a new home for yourself there. It’s wonderful too, that you have lovely French friends. I’m planning to retire to Paris in two years and would love to be in touch with you if that’s possible. I live in Long Beach now.
The French girl
I am just curious to know, how many people speak foreign languages in your country? I am French, but I live in New York and I wouldn’t expect people to speak French or hire me if I didn’t speak English. That sounds awfully arrogant to expect!
And let me state that I personally do not love Paris (where I have lived for 12 years) and I am well aware of the many defects of my fellow countrymen (and women). However, just because you don’t like something doesn’t mean you should insult it.
Joe
No dear, the difference is that compared to France, other countries will let you work if you have an OK-ish level of their language so that you get the chance to improve it as you go along.
And since you brought arrogant to the table. Isn’t it arrogant for a French company that NEEDS an employee that speaks FLUENT English, to also require from that employee to speak FLUENT French?
I have seen a few companies that had terrible reviews which stated that although the company is aimed towards English speaking people, none of their staff spoke English!! And guess what, those companies were hiring at that moment because that’s how I came over those reviews, BUT as I said they also required fluent French for the job.
Soo ok, you can’t find someone that is fluent in French, although he/she doesn’t even need it, but you continue hiring French people that can’t speak English, just because those damn other candidates only have a b1-b2 level of French aaand they are not French… iihhhm. Not arrogant at all, no, no, no.
Take a trip to other countries, learn their language to the point where you can have a basic conversation and you will see you will be able to get a job.
I went to an interview 2 weeks ago, I mentioned on my cv the fact that my French is not that good, yet the Hr called me. I write better than I talk, because guess what, French is not a widely spoken language like English is, so nobody is able to practice it for years before moving here. And although the job was related to archiving and electronic databases, so no need for extra super fluent French, I didn’t get the job although I have 11 years of experience.
I even asked the woman with which I held the interview with, why did she contact me if she saw my note about my level of French, and she said, oh because you wrote correctly. So, in the end I basically didn’t get it because I wasn’t able to talk that well. Yup, not arrogant and narrow minded aaaat all. Oh, in total, in 3 weeks, I received 7 calls, so I guess my CV is not the reason of why right now i still don’t have a job. And I’m in a semi rural area. If I were in Paris probably I would have received even more calls.
In London, my husband who didn’t spoke perfect English, got hired at Ferrari in less than 15 minutes since the interview started, and after we left the UK, the agent that got him that job was sending him emails just in case he ever wants to go back, because he has some really big clients that are interested in him…. I got a job as a Deputy shop manager although I had never done that job before in my life, but I volunteered for 2 months and that was it. I caught on super quick and the manager loved me, although she could have hired someone from the group of volunteers that were there with at least 6 months before me. Of course, they weren’t that happy that she chose me, but that’s life.
So you see, a lot of other countries are happy to understand and give a chance to those that are prepared for a certain job, even if they don’t speak PERFECTLY their language. But that is not the case in France. So I don’t know who is more arrogant here.
Instead of changing something and admitting that yes, a person from another country is, or might be better prepared than one of theirs, they would rather choose the lower quality because of their exaggerated patriotism.
The bureaucracy is and has been a nightmare for years and years, yet, nobody does anything. A few days ago, after wating for 7 months!!! for our health insurance card, we got a letter saying that they lost my husband’s copy of his birth certificate, and that I need to send them a proof that I am no longer insured in UK. Really??? After 7 fkin months?? I’m surprised they don’t use pigeons to carry their envelopes honestly, but then again, maybe they would have been more efficient that way. I heard pigeons are really into taking their tasks to the end. A thing French authorities cannot and poop on people’s heads just because. But God forbid that you don’t pay your bills and tax. That’s when they can be efficient right?
Honestly ? In Romania, which is considered a poor country and bla bla bla, you get any paper you need in less than a month, but that’s max, usually it’s two weeks, everything is done online, they don’t ask you for your ancestors papers to prove I don’t know what and they certainly do not lose your papers.
If it wasn’t for the wage problem and all the corruption, I would go back home any day. Because after seeing two of these western countries I came to the conclusion that on so, so many levels they are far more behind than a country that is seen as a third world one.
Sam
I’ve lived in multiple different cities around the world in Australia, the US, China and now France and I can easily say that Paris has been by far the hardest city for me to adapt to. It’s extremely difficult to find local friends, people generally don’t like different ways of thinking and doing things so if you don’t conform 100% you will be absolutely shat on and many people are just simply grumpy and out to step on anyone that they don’t know or care for. It definitely differs significantly from person to person though. I find that if you’re someone who thinks similarly to Parisians you may not even notice these things, but if you have a significantly different way of thinking this will become very evident to you and it isn’t always so easy to change these things. But honestly I’ve found that the majority of foreigners I know who have moved here have found it extremely difficult to adapt, at least for the first year or two. All that being said there are wonderful things about Paris and plenty of wonderful people (including Parisians). If you come across the right people and make an effort to integrate it can become a great place to live. But in Paris you really have earn it, it won’t just happen on its own like I’ve found it can in other cities, especially in the US.
Elle
Hi, I’m a student in Paris and I cried when I read this. I’m feeling excatcly the same, I want to leave. But my parents and my boyfriend they won’t trust me if I told them I hate Paris. They always tell me that I don’t try hard enough, that I’m being lazy, they blame it all on me. And you are right, I don’t need to live anyone else’s dream. I will leave as soon as I graduate. Thanks for sharing. I’m glad I found your post 🙂
Karen
Hey Elle,
I’m glad that you found this and I really hope that things improve soon for you. Support from family/friends is integral to being happy and I hope that you find someone that you can trust to talk to honestly as a good friend who gets it can make a huge difference. Sometimes being happier involves making an effort to move on as well as steps to make things more tolerable. For me, that involved going out to do more photography walks, which helped a little. Don’t give up yet and you’ll be out of there soon. Apply far and wide once you’re done with that degree!
Kind regards,
Karen
Gregor
Actually, I find many of your points pretty much your own fault, instead of negativities in Paris. First of all, if you are in the USA, would you get a job, if you don’t speak English? Probably not. So why do you expect the French to give you jobs if you don’t speak their language? I mean, it is not THAT difficult to learn a foreign language. Most of the Parisians speak well English (own experience). If they can learn English it is only polite, especially if you live there, to learn their language. Then the bureaucracy. Well: if you spent 4-5 hours at an office, again, that is your fault. Most cases can be solved digitally nowadays and it is very seldom that you actually have to go to an authority…. again, I think, if you had learned French, these experiences would not have happened to you because you would have known, to what office you’d have to go or whether a certain issue could be solved digitally. As for the dog poop, this is a common problem in the whole of Europe. I don’t know about the States in this regard… but at least it is under penalty fees, if they catch you not picking up after your dog…
Jade
“your own fault”
You are gaslighting.
“So why do you expect the French to give you jobs if you don’t speak their language?”
In certain sectors/fields, English is the standard language, no matter where you live. Business and Science are good examples. The Germans know that. The Dutch know that. The Chinese know that. And even the French know it, because people in these fields have to learn to speak and write in English, and often enlist native-English speakers to help them. This is why it is possible will find plenty of non-native francophone foreigners in France in these professional sector. So yes, for many fields, it is absolutely necessary to have a higher level of French, but that is not true for every professional field. Of course this doesn’t mean people should live in France and never learn French. That would be ridiculous, imo.
“I mean, it is not THAT difficult to learn a foreign language.”
It depends on the person AND the language. Saying that it is not difficult comes from a place of profound privilege. Privilege to afford lessons. Privilege to have enough time, and so on. Most people who are fluent in at least one other language, will admit it took them a few years (if not longer) to become fluent. And that is after constant practice, pushing through the language plateaus, feeling uncomfortable, isolated, shut out, etc. and still achieving. Are you really saying all of that is not hard?
“Most of the Parisians speak well English (own experience).”
*shrugs* They live in a tourist city. They want the benefits of tourist economy, best to have some basics in one of the most widely spoken languages in the world. Plenty of people around the world live in big tourist cities and speak English. The ones I’ve heard complain about it the most (by far) are Parisians. Even Tokyoites don’t moan as much, and few tourists/inhabits are coming with Japanese in their back pocket. Which brings me to another point. Why is it that so many Parisians expect everyone in the world to know French before arriving in France, but when they travel to non-Franco/Anglo countries, good luck getting them to speak Spanish/Japanese/German, etc.
“Most cases can be solved digitally nowadays and it is very seldom that you actually have to go to an authority….”
Nope. Where I live (not Paris, but in France), they finally started allowing citizens to deal with driving license issues digitally THIS YEAR (2018). Last year, everyone had to go to the damn prefecture and wait in million year long lines.
Think before you post.
Pamela
When I finally managed to get a hostel job in Cancun, whenever I’d check-in my fellow French people they would struggle with Spanish and then switch into French when I told them I was French not Spanish. For some reason the world wants to see me and treat me like a Hispanic or something, something that couldn’t possibly speak English let alone be or speak French. I did, however, have some of them “slip” into Spanish with me, which was vastly annoying. It still is.
Phil
Hi Karen,
I am have moved to Paris since last October to start a new work in research. I come from Latin America but I am here as a British citizen. It was good to read your article and comments from other people which might be not so happy here.
In my case I am very happy at work and somewhat happy with the infrastructure of the city. My main source of unhappiness is the “social isolation” mainly caused by the fact that I am not a fluent French speaker. I also find the French (and the Parisian in particular) hard to socialize. Moreover, dating here (I am single) seems unreasonably difficult (I already lived in 4 different countries before all in major cities and I never felt so isolated as here).
Anon
Well done on writing such a refreshingly honest blog post. I am an expatriate unhappy abroad and have been called “negative” when I have made honest comments about living in a repressed, boring and unfriendly city in Switzerland, not Paris. Why don’t I move? It is taking some time to find a job that is on par with the one I gave up to move abroad and I am adamnant that I will not settle for less after this disappointing and difficult experience. Part of being a global citizen is being open-minded about different cultures. Being a global citizen does not mean enduring unecessarily challenging or isolating conditions and it is silly to pretend to be stimulated by a culture which you are not. There are mindless expats out there who seem to have “awesome” on repeat and who act out a caricature of “the outgoing traveler”. I’d like to see them relax and be themselves and to make honest comments about their lives abroad. Many even pretend to save more money than what they do. As for the language, I don’t know anyone who has moved to a French speaking city and become fluent in French, in spite of taking a number of language courses. The most judgmental of people who I have met on the topic of language acquisition are native French speakers or those who have a background in European languages. I’d like to see them move to Africa and become fluent in Swahili within a year. It is also harder to take on a new language when there is a culture that does not welcome foreigners, who by the way are not at the mercy of the host country, nor should they sacrifice themselves to meet local expectations. Thank you for your comments about the guilt that one can feel when they don’t love their new city and cannot be grateful for the experience. Keep on blogging in your open and honest style, thumbs down to the facade!
Hatchard
Hi,
I found all of your comments so interesting, and true. Its great that people are honest. I lived in Switzerland as the trailing spouse 12 years ago, it was hard, lonely and we moved back home after 6 months.
I am about to be the trailing spouse again, but this time to a different place. What did I learn from last time that I will remember this time?
To give it longer than 6 months, that life as an expat is difficult wherever you are, to learn the language, to accept that I won’t find work for a long time, and to be happy. Life as a stay at home parent and being the trailing spouse to someone who has a better career than you is hard and lonely even in your own town.
If you want your own career, to be able to speak your own language, etc then maybe just stay at home and holiday in these places and maybe have a bit more sympathy for the ‘expats’ of different countries living in your home town.
🙂
Hatchard
Hi Anon, Switzerland is hard and so are the French and French speaking Swiss, hang on in there. Among the rude, unkind and unhelpful people I met, I did meet a handful of lovely, kind and helpful other expats and even locals.
I also had a medical issue in Switzerland and was treated with respect and kindness in the Swiss hospitals and will never forget the nurses who took me down to theatre and told all the rest of the staff that I was English and they all switched from talking in French to English.
Hope you find some friends and start to enjoy the towns and scenery, as that cheered me up quite often.
🙂
Tim
Hi Karen, I just read your post with interest. There’s a potential role within my company in Amsterdam but I was also thinking of Paris. I speak ok French – I’d be willing to learn though. The company would move by myself and my wife (both UK citizens). I’m not 100% sure of Amsterdam – I don’t speak any Dutch although I’m attracted by it’s location. Do you speak any Dutch? I guess it’s easier to live than Paris – hence you returning.
Karen
Hi Tim,
I learned Dutch while living in Amsterdam, which is fairly uncommon in Amsterdam among English native speakers. It’s actually a bit hard to learn Dutch in Amsterdam as English is so widely spoken in international workplaces. I think that Amsterdam is a great place for expats to live and fairly easy all considered. I know a lot of foreigners who exclusively worked in English in Amsterdam and never learned. I have many articles about Amsterdam, including housing in Amsterdam and cost of living in Amsterdam, that you can check. I’d encourage you to take Amsterdam over Paris if you have concerns about integrating and both of you finding work.
Best,
Karen
margaret Irby
Not a francophile, doesn’t speak French, spent two months. So non applicable. Oh wow, the courage to be negative about something you were always ill-suited for. Just nullifies my looking at any other opinions.
John L
I am retired and live part-time in Paris. Learning a foreign language well becomes more difficult with age, and the US school system (at least when I attended school) was just not set up for students to achieve bilingualism. Yet the French natives who live in NYC, in my view, regard this as a fact of life, and some French parents actually send their kids to US schools to achieve English language fluency. Americans tend to be very naive in this respect.
Pamela
If they send their kids to US schools on purpose don’t they know that that will give them the “American” accent? How stupid. They they act like they don’t want the “American” English doing anything back here in France!! I mean, at least in searching for an English-teaching job, the Czech Republic schools were upfront about “no American accents” meaning also Canadian ones too. For some reason more and more lately the world is quicker and quicker to announce loudly someone either IS or “sounds like” an American these days. I sit here at Zaventem Airport and overhear other people talking in English, which sounds like ME and no one is pouncing on THEM with “you’re an American!” sort of rubbish, just ME. And I’M the one BORN IN FRANCE. It must be racism. I’m getting essentially called a “liar” but no one white is getting called “American!” at all.
Swedish Meatball
Good post. We spent four years in Paris and loathed it. We still have a second home in France which we love to visit but are so glad not to be in Paris. For us it was too dirty, unfriendly and insular. The homelessness problem was terrible when we were there and it seems to have got worse. We both speak fluent French so that wasn’t the problem. I always say that Paris is nice for a visit but not to live. One other point, we are a same sex couple and attitudes in Paris are about 25 years behind the UK, Sweden and the Netherlands (the countries we know best). So conservative and reactionary. Very glad to be out of there and sounds like you are too. Good luck to everyone who’s still there and if you love it, good for you. A chacun son gout, each to his own taste!
Miranda
Wow I loved this article!! It’s basically everything I think and have been through since arriving a year ago. I am fluent in French, worked with French companies in London, my hometown, for over 15 years and still struggle to get an interview. Everything in Paris is prohibitive to human life in my opinion. If you have children it’s even worse as the only way to successfully navigate the city is by car. I wish you were still here so we could complain together! I have actually decided to start my own business as I am so fed up of the xenophobic attitudes of this country. I hope you found somewhere you can be happy x
Olivia
Hello Karen,
Thanks for your post. I’m not an expatriate because I’m French but sometimes I consider myself one as well. I’ve been living in Paris for 8 years but I grew up in a nice place in South of France next to Toulouse.
My boyfriend is American and has been living in Paris for 8 years as well, so I know exactly what you mean when you talk about your previous difficulties… He went through exactly the same thing his first year. Now he works as an English teacher, being moderately paid and working more than 35 hours a week (even though he has a Master’s degree). The good thing is that he’s completely fluent in French now.
However, the funny thing is even though I’m the French, my boyfriend is more adaptable in Paris than I am. For him Paris is like LA or other big cities…
I completely agree with you on the main comments I read about Paris. It’s crowded, awfully dirty, expensive, polluted and not safe.
I also feel bad in this city, especially since I’m pregnant…
We’ve decided to go back to the south of France to begin a new and better life. This city is not at all suited to start a family.
In my opinion, Paris can’t be compared to others cities in France. Paris is not France! Paris is Paris!
In the way that it’s very unique and the quality of life is really tough regarding what I had known before.
It’s a good thing you left Paris! We will do the same thing soon to settle in Toulouse! I wish you the best!!!!
DHK
I enjoyed reading this contribution, and well, whether people agree or disagree with you, you’re entitled to your opinion. I live in South Korea, which is FAR from perfect, yet many expats have settled here and even returned after leaving. I visited France in 2002 and while I don’t regret going (it was paid for as it was a biz trip), I realized that I’m not that interested in Europe. I’d much rather visit Thailand or Bali, Indonesia, than hit the Continent, and it’s partly because I’m an Asian American. At any rate, being in Paris as a tourist IS far different than living there, and a huge perk of living in Seoul is not having to speak the native language (though it’s better if you do).
Brenda
I too had similar feelings recently in Paris. In January I bought a studio apartment in Paris — the 18th, not quite Montmartre. Bought it site unseen, for a good price, looked for 18 months before I found the right one. Not novice at buying property in France as five years ago I (we) bought a stone longere in Brittany — now talk about challenges. Not only did we have language difficulties (and Bretons rarely speak English) but we had to “rebuild” the house. We had to do this in the dead of winter as my BF only has the winter season off, Add to this we had to buy a car and all the problems, i.e., CT and all the problems of an aging Peugeot. After spending 5 years rebuilding (at 2-3 months a shot). It’s worth it. The Bretons are lovely people and consider themselves Bretagne first, French second.
I find thru the years that we do stepping stones: one stone can lead to another. Years back I did rent an apartment in Paris as a trail along. Had teo young children and a dog. Didn’t stay as long as planned, was homesick. But it was a stepping stone. Seven years ago started renting apartment in Paris. Alone this time, except for the dog I brought along. If it hadn’t been for this I wouldn’t have thought of actually buying a house in France. The transaction went as smooth as glass. Had a Dutch RE agent doing business in France. So for the Paris apartment I used him again. See, stepping stones.
The sale went smoothly, except the Dutch agent disappeared for the final phase. However the French RE agent who listed the sale, who felt less than fluent at English bit the bullet and we completed the sale with a melange of English and French emails.
Now the interesting part of this is the neighborhood where my studio apartment is located. It’s totally ethnic, dirty, noisey, traffic saturated and even dangerous. Large expanses of glass are spiderwebbed with kicked-in designs.Yep, the streets are smeared with dog poop and vile spit dollops. Now, if we keep the dog poop in perspective, stepping in it and transferring it to your apartment floor is probably not life threatening. But when your dog carries vile things in on his little puppy feet and he sleeps in your bed. The transfer of the spit dollops, i.e., say disease from Africa, the Middle East, yes, that’s life threatening. So, I believe the Parisiennes really don’t care about dog poop in the bigger scale of things. Thus don’t expect the dog poop to disappear.
For the new apartment I made a plan to stay for 2 months. I was really an arbitrary decision to stay that long. Furnishing the apartment and setting up utilities with EDF and contracts with property management should take a long time, I thought. To furnish the apt should take a while too, but my very ethnic street had all kinds of shops, right out of the middle east to haggle with on price — keep in mind that my French is basic, greetings, numbers, weather, menus — but when it comes to selling/buying everyone understands each other. Everything was accomplished in 2 weeks. Neighborhood exploring revealed I wasn’t that far from Sacre Coeur and a beloved neighborhood I could walk to in half an hour.
Then, of course, we have our crime. Always on the lookout for thieves on the Metro. I never walk down the street talking on my phone but on one Sunday afternoon, my daughter in California called and I debated in my mind to answer it or not. Answered it, and while I was talking it was snatched out of my hand from behind. Two young African men took off in a sprint, and I behind them. And when I say “African” I’m not being racist. That’s what the Parisiennes call them. Lots of immigrants in my neighborhood. Right next to my door entry is the —– shop. Maybe it was one of those —–? They network there; they need phones and phones are in high demand. They want to stay, but only one in four is accepted. A New York friend said to me on the incident, “If you were in NY you would have been socked in the face, and your nose broken.” I just lost a phone. It did affect me because I relied so much on that phone — to call the US, use as a hot spot to listen to French music on Spotify, to connect to the internet in the apt. I suddenly felt totally isolated. Yes, I then left Paris two weeks early, stayed 6 weeks instead of my arbitrary 8 weeks. But of course I’m going back. I like challenges, but I know the feelings of depression. I made no friends there, except for the people I bought from on the street who always wave and say “bonjour” and the —— who have a —– shop on the other side of my door, always a smile as they have the small apartment next to mine that they use as a storeroom. The wafting of the smell of onions in the early morning as they move a 300 lb bag of onions into it.
Karen, I do have the option of returning, but I will be with someone the next time, my BF. Being alone is difficult in Paris, and you have the two of you. Two months of giving it a try is not enough. I actually think you will return as an expat because you have done your stepping stone. It gets easier.
(Edited by admin to protect reader privacy. Kind reminder: Don’t include information that gives away your address…)
Summer
This was a really great read. This is what so many people deal with whenever they move out of their home country and go somewhere else. I had a couple of professors in college who had their PhD in their home country and had to basically start over. It sucks. But I guess it’s the growing pains of being an expat.
Hope you enjoy the next place you live more.
JTM
I am very interested in this subject as a budding international civil servant who is considering posts in Paris. I absolutely appreciate this blog post and find both the post and comments enlightening. I’ve heard about the (in)famous bureaucracy in abstract, but so much not in detail (with the exception of one native French friend’s comment on how much easier of a time he had getting a driver’s license in New York City than he did in Paris!) Do you mind my asking what administrative tasks I should prepare/brace myself for in the event I do decide to accept a post in Paris (opening a bank account, getting utilities setup, any local ID)? I anticipate some onboarding assistance (from the hiring organisation) regarding lodging. Many thanks for the insight!
Melusine
This cracked me up. As a French teacher and francophile, I lived in Paris for years and I can agree that if you don’t reaaaaaally want to be there (I totally wanted to be there) or don’t have a lot of money (I didn’t), the city can chew you up and spit you out! Did you know that the Japanese have a syndrome for the shock of discovering that Paris isn’t what they thought it would be?? Poor things arrive in Paris and are so disillusioned they need therapy. Enjoy! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_syndrome
Canelle
Very good read, thank you.
I don’t live in Paris, but I have lived and do live in France for 3 years. This post spoke to me, because I have many of the same issues, although outside of Paris. I imagine the pollution, rudeness, competition and dirt are worse in Paris compared to where I have lived and do live now.
My language level is still intermediate, and it is really a struggle to improve when few people will speak to me because I am not fluent. I honestly don’t care if someone just speaks to me; I understand, it just takes some time to reply. But I am a good listener…I promise!
I still take hours of courses each week, but it is clearly not enough. I thought that after 3 years, it would be better. I suppose I just don’t get enough speaking practice. I rarely complain about these things outside of my house (even online), because people will usually gaslight, or say that I should just leave. I would leave, but my S.O. is French, so I stay. The gaslighting can be difficult especially when coupled with insults about my country (I am American). Yet, when I complain about French bureaucracy, every French person with 1 km will tell me to stop speaking badly about their country, even though they know it is true.
I too have advanced degrees, but they mean nothing because I cannot get a professional job given my intermediate level of French. So, the pressure of starting life over again in the 30s zaps my energy for improving in the language. Unfortunately, I am also a person of color, so I’ve had some not great experiences in France based upon that. Of course being from the USA, I am very familiar with racism, but this, coupled with nationality and language, can all be too much at times.
Some people in the comments say that it gets better with time, and I hope that they are right. I’ve already given 3 years, and I am unsure if I can stay 5+ years…maybe, as someone else said, I will have to sell my soul.
Anyway, thanks again for your post. I just wanted to state that many things you said about Paris could be applied to various places in France. It means a lot to me to know that there are others who agree.
Best wishes.
Pamela
Well, I too am “of colour” but was born in the DOM-TOM so I am French and I refuse to let it treat me like an “American” just because that’s where I got my degrees. Barring some miracle job offer that pays room and board and a salary AND airfare and transportation, I’m here to stay, I have no other choice. I’m too old and weak, too broke, too tired of living like this, I mean, I’m near the end. I mean, sure the smaller cities would be easier to get housed in, and off the streets, but they’re notoriously worse for blacks, in no small part because they treat me initially like I look like “African” which means “immigrant, doesn’t belong here”. When I start talking in French, it’s usually not long before these assholes (probably Arabs themselves, which explains everything) start calling me an “American” anyway, and I’m starting to think I’m going to end my life rotting away in some French prison for assault, I’ve had so much of that my entire life. “On paper” I’m French, but when I start speaking, even FRENCH, people start calling me an “American” and switch into English. I had that happen in Wallonia, where I was staying, but that’s was also because the proprietor was going around telling people that I was an American. I had to keep yelling at him “BORN IN FRANCE just like YOU” (but in French) I finally left. That was, of course, Belgium, and actually France is treating me a little BETTER about that. It’s insulting when someone born in France starts speaking French and the other person switches immediately into English, unless of course the person is actually Flemish. Belgium sucks, but France sucks less. And dumpster diving isn’t illegal in France, so I won’t STARVE.
Charles
It’s too bad you didn’t like Paris. I am moving there soon and have the same feeling – that I won’t like it – but because I don’t normally like big cities. I think you might be the same way.
Over the course of looking online for reviews, videos or advice about Paris, I find one thing even harder to find than people saying they don’t like Paris…
That is, men who write about their expat lives in Paris. Every blog is some lady in their 20s (in college) or 30s (as a young professional/spouse). That makes me wonder if I am an abnormality in Paris – a man moving to Paris to be with his gf/wife-to-be?
I am sure I am not the only one, but I haven’t found any online yet.
Nick
Charles, I am a 29 year old Englishman who followed his girlfriend here (French) after 4 years of relationship in the UK. 1 year on and I am returning back to the UK, as a single man.
OP describes Paris to the point and I relate to all of it. In hindsight, I wouldn’t bother coming unless you speak French to a high standard or have a very supportive partner. I came here with no French and did just an 8 week course when I arrived.
Career wise, relationship and general well-being for me have been at an all time low, but with that said, there is still a lot to love here. You really do have to be prepared to adapt and embrace the culture for what it is.
I would be happy to have a chat with you if you want to discuss?
Karen thanks for the post!
Anita
I’ve been living in Paris for two months now and I definitely don’t like everything about this city, but you keep contradicting yourself.
You say the Metro during rush hour is packed (2.2 million people are living here, did you seriously expected something else), the job market is very competitive and real Paris is expensive. Haven’t you visited the city before and thought well about moving here? You could have known, that it’s quite pricey. So these are no arguments against Paris but arguments for your romantic view of Paris.
These are just a few examples of your inconsistency.
Who are you now? Because it sounds like you are the person who thought Paris will be all about champagne, macarons, pretty dresses and romantic after all.
paul
Come on Paris is beautiful probably the prettiest with Rome in Europe…
but to live it’s aweful!
Overpopulated, dirtyness, expensive as hell ,colonization of suburbs and neo rich who invest in the center. The city is also very oriented lgbt and artisty richy hipster … But if you’re average it’s hard to find his place..
In 2018 I don’t see any reason to move there it’s full already. The mindset of french are shit in general ( I am french) . They don’t care about foreigner , they re very cliquish and narrow minded and that everywhere in France. Paris just combinated all of this but worst..
Sia
Dear Paul thank you for being so full of light and courage to be able to take criticism despite being French! Yes Paris the city is spectacularly beautiful. But the people , the attitude , the strong but subtle hate for foreigners is harsh… Due to several unbelievably harsh and severely isolating experiences i have begun to believe that the universe was conspiring against me when I decided to move to Paris
Pamela
As a fellow French person, this “mindset of French people is shit” – well, sure, I”m only half French, and the French side of my family is pretty much shit but not as much as these Arabs, sorry. They’re the absolute worst part of the world France must be sorry as hell it ever set foot on. And unfortunately that’s what seems to be “taking over” Paris and probably the larger cities, too. But what can I do, I can’t live in the smaller towns with no Arabs because then it’s all-white and that’s even bigger Shit for a black French person. Last time I was on my way back from Wallonia, the train had a massive layover in Lille, and I asked someone who’d said they were from Martinique (my fellow DOM-TOM) how living in Lille was for them, if there were any sizeable number of blacks in Lille, and of course by this (being different “groups” of “French black people” we know what we’re talking about) meaning “not those Africans or Arabs, you know what I mean” they seemed to think they were doing OK in Lille. Without saying anything else I’ll just say that there’s much, much worse shit than French people.
sia
Hi Karen , thank you for the bang-on post! I am overwhelmed to discover that someone else too feels the same way as I have been all my years in Paris. I am excruciatingly isolated , discriminated against (subtly so that i can’t complain) ,overlooked even though i spoke french fluently when I arrived.Paris demands you shrink your heart, and fit in if you will. I think it is important for people to know in Paris it doesn’t get better with time.
Aurore
I am French, living in Paris, writing on expat issues, etc. so I have been surfing on internet looking for testimonies, etc. I can’t blame you guys for not enjoying Paris. There are so many things I hate about the city. Everything is expensive, people are rude and dirty, etc, etc. I can’t disagree with you. 2 things though. No one mentioned culture and to be honest, museums and exhibitions are the one aspect of Paris that I really love. I went to many different locations (NY, London, Tokyo, etc.) and Paris to me is the richest when it comes to bringing and showing art and culture. Second, I think lots of us when moving abroad do fantasize at some point. When I moved to NY for instance, I was so excited and even though I did love the city, I went through a hell lot of frustrations and struggles. Paris has some to offer but you need to come with no exspectations at all (I know it’s hard). For those of you feeling really isolated (so sorry Sia for such a bad experience) don’t hesitate to answer my comment, I ll be glad to send you my instagram address to exchange a bit or give you some tips if I can. PS : I am picking up after my dog!!!! And I am polite (always) and friendly (sometimes)
Pamela
The only expectation I came with was that at least here it’s not “illegal” to be French and I should stop getting arrested for that!!! And can’t be deported anymore. I also fully expect that I’ll die of starvation sleeping at the Airport until whatever time I can actually get into “logement social” if that takes too long. I did not expect the job market in I.T. or math or physics to be any better than the States because I am still “black” here. My only expectation has been that I’ll just die in the country I have a right to BE in and not as some “illegal immigrant.” In fact it will probably take me several weeks of being legally able to “dumpster dive” my way into the unsold food from the airport restaurants and stores, to get off of this starvation mode to where I’ll have the strenth to wheel my luggage with me to go to a damn CHRS to seek even “emergency” logement. My stuff isn’t so much that it’s “heavy” it’s that I’m “weak” and tired all the time and still not recovered from that Stroke I had last year.
But other than that, no, no expectations whatsoever.
Ann
Omg… It has been almost two years since I came to Paris…nothing has worked for me. I used to live and work on Ireland, never had a problem to get a job, never god a racist comment…here on Paris, despite my international work experience, my Bachelors and being fluent in french… I cant get a proper job… I moved for love but im trying to move back to Ireland… To much pollution, racism… Etc…etc… I thank you A LOT for this seriously… Nobody gets me !
Pamela
I’m half-Irish, by birth, my father was born in Belfast and I’ve always looked to him (while he was alive) and considered Ireland my rightful home if all else failed, too. I was actually born on French soil but don’t even remember it, so even though this, too, is my birthright and my “inheritance” it’s that “world I never knew.” Being here stuck at the damn Airport this long, I can see why my father LEFT here and took me with him (that and a lot of other things about my mother….but as this is “her” country I can see why my father left HER, too….) he wanted better for me than what my French mother could have, would have, or was going to give me and this country, too.
As half-Irish I find it extremely notworthy that other French people are heading to Ireland in droves these days, saying there are more (I.T) jobs there and that we treat people better than this. I mean, for one thing, and this is just one example; I’m here at Orly Airport, had to get an urgent package from London, and when it got here the asshole at LaPoste wouldn’t accept my Permis de Conduire as identification to pick it up, said I needed a full passport (I flew in on a Laissez-Passer which if you don’t know this, that’s a one-way “ticket” back to where you were born and they confiscate that at the port of entry when you get there, it’s like a “one trip only” temporary travel document) or an actual carte nationalité and since I keep getting robbed overseas all I have of THAT is a photocopy so the bastard basically wasn’t going to let me have my own MAIL. And I have a printout from Service-Public.fr that says that a permis de conduire is too an acceptable form of ID for things like picking up mail. I wasn’t trying to bloody well FLY back to Ireland on it, for God’s sake. That’s what I mean by “asshole” treatment.
Jean
I have been living in Paris for 19 years (this year anniversary). It was my dream to live there. Coming from the countryside and having been raised in a rural area from the center of France, I wanted to live in a big city. In this big city in particular. I remember traveling with my parents to Paris when I was a child and being totally amazed by the beauty of the city. I remember the sculptures on the top of the Alexandre III bridge towers by night, looking up from the rear window of my father’s car, those giant fantastic winged creatures that were made of gold… It was like an electric shock, love at first sight.
Dog poop: It’s been years People have changed their behavior about it. Anyway even if that was true it wouldn’t be something that would compel me to move away. Sometimes of course I feel that I’d be happier in a greener place. I feel outraged by the cost of food. At the supermarket, There’s still a 3 / 4% difference between the place where my parents live in the dordogne valley and Paris. It’s not that it’s impossible to overcome but it’s unfair. And of course there’s the cost of housing. Still delirious and growing. That said I still feel happy here. The metro is ok and if you can’s stand it there’s the bus, taxis, velib, scooters that you can borrow and let everywhere, auto lib (although the current mayor killed it, apparently there will be a new system soon…), and the city is actually more walkable than London or New York. It’s not that I go to the Louvre or any parisian attraction everyday. But it’s great to know that I can do it. The other day I wanted to listen to classical music live. I just had to click on the internet and find a Schubert chamber music concert just a 5 minutes walk from home. That I couldn’t do in my home town. Of course with comfort every perspective change: If you have to live in a chambre de bonne, unless you love Paris for itself or have some kind of personal dream or connection with the city, it’s better to leave. But if one insist one can make a home there, like anywhere. Finally everything comes down to personal views and circumstances. Paris is not harsh or tough per se. It is so diverse and big it gives the feeling that everything is possible. And that’s true in a sense, everything is possible there. But is it Paris or is it because one is still young and full of desire and curiosity? How to be sure about it? Paris is a great place to live. It’s a fantastic city that is not comparable with any other one.
Vogel
Thank you so much for the honest reply. It seems most people’s unhappiness is not from Paris but merely that fact that they don’t have a well paid job and thus live on a meager subsistence. That would be the same in any city. As for the rent and food costs, it’s normal for food prices to be higher as a result of greater demand for living & commercial spaces and thus higher rents. This is the same in NY and London. The language barrier is definitely an issue but one needs to respect a culture and learn the language or be happy to not interact. I have lived in New York, London, Berlin, Barcelona and Singapore. The 2 factors that affect my happiness the most are my INCOME and SIGNIFICANT OTHER. If you have the means then every City is a Beautiful!
Pamela
Walkable…as long as you aren’t wheeling your luggage everywhere you go looking for a place to stay like a Squat, which is preciesly why I stay here at the damned Airport. Housing prices – the “income based” logement social has waiting lists years long but that’s mainly in Paris in the areas people want to live and probably the other large cities in the areas of them where people want to live, too. For some reason 13th Arrondissement of Marseille has “extra” T1s and T2’s at least according to the demande-logement-social website. Now like I said, I was only born here and I have no idea how “bad” the 13th Arrondissement of Marseille must be to have so much “availability.” And another place with housing availability is Roubaix, up along the border with Wallonia, suburb of Lille. Again, there are reasons for this. Probably severe unemployment and high crime as a result of it. But what the hell, I can’t live at Orly Airport forever!! I can’t even contact Assistance Social from here, all I can do is do what little I can do online on the Airport’s wi-fi and sit here and WAIT. And apply for live-in jobs which of course only take actual foreigners, and all that. And here we are coming up on the month when the government shuts down entirely for some unknown reason.
But the only good thing is that while I wait forever for God knows what, at least scavenging food isn’t illegal here like it was in Belgium where I initially got stood up and left stranded at the Airport by someone who was supposedly going to let me stay with them.
But what I will say is that one’s tolerance – I mean happiness anywhere does depend on income and presence or absence of a significant or insignificant other. With a committed enough significant other (read: one who was willing and able to support both of us through the fact that even with more than one University degree I can never seem to get or keep a decent JOB in my field even though it’s I.T., math and Physics) who himself had enough income then I would be more tolerant of even, say, Moscow (which is where my ex- wanted to go back to, to his mother and sister because London wasn’t working out for him; he was a lawyer back in Russia but only ever able to get a £5/hour factory job in London even after we married “for papers.”) I think I would have hated Moscow too back then but now I’m regretting that decision because now after all these years I’m winding up living in Airports frantically applying for emergency “social housing” and waiting 6-8 weeks for a mere €200 to deposit and clear into my bank account back in Canada – because of the currency conversion and the cheque being from overseas, they said. Wow, I’m sitting here now thinking that living in Moscow in some Khrushchyovka would be better than living in Orly Airport.
Paul Lambert
Wow lol. I visited Paris for a few days back in about 1990.
One of my main memories of the place is the large amount of dog poo on the pavements (sidewalks).
Sounds like it’s still the same. 🙁
Robert
I live in Paris since last November, too. But after reading some of the comments, I’ve just doubted if we live in same city.
Maybe, it’s because the metro we use, the area we work and live in.
I use Ligne J, and metro 9, everyday for my commute, and works at Grands Boulevards. Also, I’m an asian.
Some of you guys mentioned, the racism is very high. Seriously, though? How many countries have you ever been to? If you moved from London, I would understand. But, as an Asian family, technically we received ZERO racist comments in last one year. 2 alcoholic women shouted to us Chinese, but I really don’t care, since they are just alcoholics.
I strong agree with the bureaucracy. Honestly, fuck them. But, I needed to go to the administration only for first few months, now I’ve got all my papers, so, it was just temporary.
There is a lot of comments about Parisians. Since, I’ve moved from Tokyo, I usually expect everyone to be cold. So, I become happy when someone is nice to you on the street. Comparing to Tokyo, I think Parisians are very natural, very helpful people.
About job market, it depends on the profession. I’m software engineer without any French. Even, though I receive many messages on LinkedIn daily basis. Also, I’ve got an offer from my current company, when I was in Tokyo, and we used English for the interview.
But, my wife is a BI analyst. She is struggling to fund a job in English, so she is studying French, currently.
Overall, I prefer to live in Paris than Tokyo.
Pamela
Those of us complaining about racism are probably all either Black or “half” Black read “looks Black or worse, Arab.”Asians seldom get treated as badly as Blacks.
DP
Sounds like Zurich, Singapore, Hong Kong and most other places I’ve lived… While I expected less personal awareness in Asia, I found it worse in Europe. You get used to it but after 12 years it still drives me crazy. Smiling is not a normal thing outside the USA – scowling is the norm; as is staring. Then again, so is looking at the ground so that you don’t have to give way… Paris is now on my horizon. This blog is helpful. But also remember that it’s the differences are part of what make an experience different (even though driving you crazy).
Craig B
Thank you for your post. I spent almost a year in Paris when I was 22 and I occasionally come back to visit (though not very often). I am now 50. I can see Paris as being a very, very competitive place. They don’t seem to have enough to share for ‘outsiders’ or foreigners. I think the French are culturally open, or try to be, and inquisitive but integration is not something that is easily put into practice except on a token / show level considering fiscal and monetary constraints and the pie being take up by French people already (who apparently are engaged in intense fights among themselves for a share). . Paris is not a boomtown like San Francisco and Silicon Valley (where I live now). But that is really in a lot of ways, a very good thing. Parisians may be “cold and assholes” but they are warm and fuzzy compared to tech / Bay Area people.
Pamela
Thanks for that. I keep saying, there are worse things than being French. There are worse things I could be than French.
awesome tomato
I think people’s opinions about Paris depend on their original culture backgrounds. I’ve been living here for almost three years. Never liked it. I was lucky enough to come here for a job in an academic environment in the first place and was able to change to a job in industrial settings. But I told my then boyfriend now husband, both of these job experiences are disappointing. I got my education in the US then worked in Canada. I can see many limitations and shortcomings in the French work settings- much lack of flexibility and efficiency, stubborn hierarchical mindset. To me, frenches has a long way to go. But I talked to some of my coworkers from other continents and countries, which French is part of their official languages, and found out they have exactly the opposite opinions to mine. They think this country is organized, (?!) advanced(???). To them, they landed in a better place.
My French husband now has come to a point that he cannot bear the shitness of Paris anymore and we eventually reach agreement to leave this place. My French husband, that’s the only thing I’m gonna take from France.
Pamela
My Russian husband was the only think I liked about LONDON.
William
53 days to go and we are free from this hell hole! Moved here about 10 months ago and it is all true: your dreams will be crushed. Yes, we are saving money on healthcare and education, but I am headed to Amsterdam where I can do the same thing and where people smile and there is not dog crap and cigarette butts everywhere. Can’t wait for my next starry-eyed adventure. Hope this one isn’t as crushing as Paris!
Sia
Hi William. Hope you are doing great in Amsterdam! Bravo to you for having moved from this hell hole Paris. I am happy for u. But also mildly envious. I face xenophobia every single day in Paris even though I spoke perfect French before I arrived here. It is so crushing, I cannot find words. I dream of moving out and to come back NEVER.
Nicole
Honestly, I found this because whenever I get drunk I always think about moving to Paris to do freelance remote work and how great it would be. I was looking at apartments and visa requirements.. I needed someone to slap my drunk self in the face and tell it that this is a terrible idea and I shouldn’t do it.
Thank you for writing this. Drunk me will remember this next time.We’ll pick another more reasonable city/country to dream about.
Thomas Samarati
I’ve been to Paris 20+ times. Longest stay was 6 weeks. I don’t hate Paris, I am ambivalent. Seen it, done that, no need to ever return. My experiences in Lyon have been more humane than Paris. Lower prices, better food, nicer locals. Better weather. I think that the dismal Paris citizen has year round constant seasonal affect disorder. The frequent gray and damp / cold weather certainly makes for sullen people. Can you relate Moscow folks?
I live in sunny northern California wine country. I travel for food exploration, but really have little need to do so anymore after circling the globe a dozen times.
Live where you are happy.
Dom
Hello!
I’m a Polish student and I decided to move to Paris with my boyfriend few months ago. We are a gay couple and my boyfriend comes from an Arab country and used to live and work in Emirates for few years, We were in a long-distance relationship for some time living in different countries, We decided to move to Paris to finally live together, do our studies (continue career for my boyfriend) and live in a place where we don’t have to hide and can live freely considering that the countries of our origin are still rather opressive for gay people.
Thank you for your post, it is really comforting and soothing to read it. Now we’re in the process of realizing how bad decision it was to choose Paris as a place of a longer stay (considering the ressources we’ve invested and not only…). We both speak French on B2/C1 level, but finding a job is a real struggle when you don’t speak like a French. Dealing with Parisians in daily situation is a challenge (any administration or customer service).I feel like Parisians don’t really understand what assertivity is, they are simply agressive and they can tell you nasty things (btw they are the masters of irony and sarcasm) once you asked too much even in a polite way. It feels like everybody is so tense, on the verge of exploding, covering it with their ‘bourgeois’ manners. Their version of individualism makes it difficult to cooperate for new-comers like us. We live in the northern Paris and I don’t consider it a safe place for gay couples or single women… you have to be really careful not to attract negative attention from people who look simply like criminals, drinking or selling drugs/cigarretes on the streets.
I know that what I write is bitter and pessimist. Of course we’re trying, but damn it’s not easy. I was never aware of that as a tourist. This city is so beautiful but so depressive at the same time, seeing so many homeless and simply sad people for whom, I believe, it is also hard to survive (mainly immigrants). Not mentioning the smell of urine on every CORNER of this city. It all has this negative effect on you… But still I’m hoping for the better, it is a huuuuge lesson. 🙂
Sophie M
I was so in love with French culture when I moved to Paris without a job or place to olive, that I fought tooth and nail to do everything necessary to make it work out : fluent french, degree from a top french university, but the truth is that after 25 years, I have never been integrated by the French, rather have been an object of exploitation more than anything else (Employers who got me take on Responsibility I was not given the Grade for, men and friends who used me). I became agressive dealing with people most of the time as it seems to be the way to do things to survive here. Yes Paris is beautiful and interesting,
I agree with the blogger who said, Paris is a tough city and you need to be thick skinned to get the most out of it. I am not. My great regret is staying on too long. I am now stepped in so far that returning were as tedious as go o’er… (dixit Macbeth).
yvonne
I thank you all for your comments. I was considering moving to Paris just for the experience and to say I lived in Paris for a year. I think I’ll just watch from the television and save myself the money and the experience. I’m really glad I researched this before I leaped.
Alejandra
Hello,
I really liked your post and the honesty is refreshing, i really think you capture exactly what a lot of people struggles everyday while living in Paris. I’ve been living in Paris for almost 3 years and i made this decision after having a 7 month exchange experience back in 2015. For me it was quite different as it clicked from the very beginning and thats why i decided to move for good to Paris (im from Mexico by the way), but yes since this first experience i knew that if i wanted to actually live here and adapt i had to learn french and thats what i did before coming this second time for a Masters degree. Now i can say im “more adapted”, i have a first job in my area of studies, i work mainly in french but i can speak in english and even in spanish as it is an international european company :), im living by myself for the first time (in a small studio but hey im happy of every meter of the 18m2. BUUUUUUUUT, and yes everything sounds nice to this point, i still struggle from time to time with grumpy expat feelings, for not being able to meet new people that easily (i agree, Parisians are not the easiest people to deal with), i also blame the seasons of the year here, having most of the year a cold weather with gray skies doesnt help much to my mood, as i want to stay inside and also socialize less.
Thats why i loved your article, it made me feel identified, and i think its quite easy to bottle our feelings, but in real life there are a lot of expats living in Paris in the same situation and im on my search to meet these people 😀
Rimal
I want to thank you first for being homest and writing your experience about Paris!
I am living here since April2019, It was so hard to find a suitable accommodation, the transportation was complicated to understand at first and I bought wrong tickets at times, had to pay an “Amande!” To the controlleurs! Even though I told them I do not understand French that well but they just asked me to pay, the next time that happened I never paid and kept saying that I am not paying so they let me go.
Other than dog poop, getting used to smelling “urine” in every corner especially in metro stations. The homeless people everywhere asking you for money. The women who Try to steal you or deceive you at Gare du Nord, every fucking time. The stress, everyone running, everyone is late, stressed… having to use the metro and travel underground in a polluted environment everyday.
The things are like is that even if I walk near where I work I can see beautiful places, Notre dame, seine… Paris is good for tourism and a weekend. But life in it is though 🙂 really. And then people (who has never lived in Paris) envy you for living there! And hell no you cannot complain.
Cedric
I’m french born and raised in Paris living abroad.
I read with interest your experience and all the complaints in the comments.
While i can relate to most complaints, it seems your experience was mostly negative due to the lack of job opportunity(and hence money) and your inability to speak french. Can you really blame a city for a depressed job market and people not speaking your native language? You also write that you left NY because ou didn’t want to live in a big city but yet you relocated in the largest city in Europe. You can be happy pretty much anywhere if you have money and good friends; the city itself is often irrelevant. While there are many legitimate reasons to dislike Paris most of the complaints i’ve read are quite generic and i’ve read the same from expats from many other major cities. People come to Paris with the expectation to find an affordable, prosperous multicultural, open & accepting progressive city such as NY, London, Berlin, Sydney, or whatnot but it is a far stretch from being one.
France is an old traditional conservative homogenous country worn by decades of economic stagnation, endemic corruption, and stubbornly high unemployment. This is hardly a secret and extensively documented all over the medias so i don’t really understand the whining from these expats who decide to relocate to Paris and complain about not finding a job.
Like in most welfare southern european countries purchasing power is low, jobs are scarce and for many daily life is a painful grind to make both end meet. It’s been like that for the past 30/40 years. Nothing new here.
This dire economic situation paired with out of control mass uneducated immigration from africa naturally had a toll on the general mood which partially explains why people are so depressed, whiny and sometime xenophobic.
I read complaints about the administration but i have dealt with many administrations in the world including the american one, and the french administration is by a mile more efficient than in the US.
Now talking about language, while many young in Paris speak english, the country has an old ingrained rivarly toward Anglo saxons inherited from hundreds of years of territorial war still tangible nowadays. Even though the french & the british both lost their colonial territories and buried the hatchet long ago, english persisted in northern america and subsequently became the world language. French somehow still live in the past glory of their former prosperous colonial empire and secretely feel frustration at the loss of their dominant position on the world stage which partially explains the occasional hostility toward english language. As France borders the Uks in the north and the US on the west, it is also naturally at the frontline of westernization and many in the country feel their lifestyle and language are threatened by american culture.
I am not trying to be apologetic of French ignorance or reluctancy to speak other languages but just want to share a bit of background.
My personnal opinion as a former parisian who lived in different world cities is that beyond the pretty architecture life in Paris is depressing and boring. Too many narrow minded people too much negativity, judging, funny looks. Too much aggressiveness sadness and stress. The city is filthy and generally unsafe. Rule of law is very loose and corrupt and led to a significant degradation of the security situation in the country over the past decades. Statistics are biaised and manipulated and i know from high ranking police officers friends in Paris that violent armed crime has been rising exponentially.
The city is grey the weather is generally grey, there are little trees and greenery in the city and the air is extremely polluted by mass of diesel cars. I find the city quite grim. Political islam is rising quickly and creating tensions and unease in the country. It is not best time to move to France, and i won’t come back to Paris.
Pamela
As to the well-renowned anti-Anglo-Saxon bias in France, since I’m only half-French-Polynesian anyway I’ve taken to removing my. maiden name off of everything (and I’m even working on doing it officially as some of the Mairies put numerous obstacles in our way of what they feel is “our husband’s name” on our ID like wanting his birth certificate? Fine, I’ll get it, but serve them right if they can’t READ it. It’ll be in Russian.) so that they can’t see the “Irish” part as the world thinks I’m “lying” about that and I’m sure that’s part of why I was getting nowhere fast – as a Kennedy for so much of my life. I’ve had people on AuPair websites, on which I had my picture, tell me “you don’t look Irish or French.” Racists. I’m pretty sure I’ll be stuck on the Dole forever….
David
Best comment in this thread!
The French girl
Thanks for that great comment Cedric! The background information you provide is accurate and well-summarized, and I feel it’s something prospective expats totally miss out on when they consider Paris as a destination. I do love my country, but right now it certainly not in its best shape.
Decades of political inertia have created a strong feeling of mistrust of the political/economical elites, the welfare state is seen now as something you should take advantage from rather than receive support when you really need it (a lot of young people, including with college degrees, view a phase of paid unemployment as a benefit they are entitled to, rather than a safety net they should hope never to need). The growing inequalities and high unemployment rate amongst less privilege classes, on the other, foster strong social antagonism and I feel this anger infuses everyday interactions.
So, yes, it’s an amazingly beautiful city, the food is truly great, there’s good access to high quality medical care, traveling is (relatively) cheap and the cultural offer is impressive. However, the negative mindset and narrow-mindedness of Parisians are strong enough a drawback to taint the whole experience. I am currently living in New York, which is unarguably one of the toughest cities on this planet, and now that I am out of the adaptation phase I find it waaaaaay easier and more pleasant a daily life than the one I had in Paris. There’s no way I am going back to Paris. Unfortunately, we have to go back to Europe, but we have chosen Amsterdam over Paris (and this is how I found this blog, ha!) because of the negativity and lack of tolerance/openness that we had come to loath in Paris.
However, I will say this : my first 12 months in New York have been horrible. We have a pleasant apartment in a lovely neighborhood, made friends right away, and overall I would say that our arrival was rather smooth; however, getting cut off from my job (which proved to be a much bigger part of my identity than I thought), depending on my husband for a living (I had always been financially independent), struggling with the health care system here, and just globally feeling isolated and purposeless in my first months here was a LOT harder than anything I had expected to the point where I wasn’t sure I wanted to stay (when living in NY had been my lifelong dream). But then things got slowly better, and now I am totally in love with my life here – like, not in a starry-eyed and romanticly naive way, but in a “I know you know and love you in spite of your flaws and drawbacks way”. It takes TIME to settle somewhere, and everyone told me the first year is the hardest: that’s true. Also, I really helps to talk to people going through the same thing as your friends back home can’t/won’t understand and it can feel totally frustrating (and YES, French people have the same thing with New York that Americans have with Paris: if you live there, then your life is necessarily awesome, even when you try to explain that a pediatrician visit just cost you $200).
Thanks for sharing that Karen, and thanks for everything you put out there in general. I hope we get to meet when I arrive in Amsterdam this fall!
k.
Best of luck with the move! 🙂
Pamela
I was born in France (well in the DOM-TOM, anyway) and I’m having a hard time finding anything, accommodation, jobs, anything. Partially it’s because I”m “black” and partially I’m thinking it’s because they see all these “foreign” degrees on my CV (“American” ones like Yale). I don’t know what it is, but at least being born there I qualify for social assistance to keep me alive, I hope.
Annie
First of all thank you for sharing your story and everyone who was commenting below. I was trying to find some stories of a people, who had bad times while living in Paris and just randomly found this blog post.
I’m not the exception – after spending 5 years in Paris I’m desperate of finding a job in my home country or elsewhere, just pack my bags, leave and never come back. I wish I could share a success story, but my experiences in this city were harsh and stressful. Now some little message, who are still dreaming about moving to the city of lights..
First of all – my honest advice – don’t move or dream about living in Paris if you don’t have a work transfer, or a job contract in hand. Otherwise you’ll be stuck in under qualified client service jobs, miserable salary and huge rat-race concurrence for a better bite. It took me 5 years until I’ve found an office job and believe me – I was applying for many different positions actively all this time. Secondly – a language thing. Either you speak French FLUENTLY, or you don’t bother at all. Moderate French, or fluency in other languages isn’t an option in France. Except you’re fine with washing dishes in the restaurants, or handing in flyers at the metro..
So, what are the reasons why Paris became so unbearable to live for many and many other expats I believe? It’s shit expensive (the other day I’ve paid 6.5 euros for cafe au lait just in a random bistro, which was an absolute shock), it’s dirty, it’s filled with homeless people, asking for money on every corner, it’s polluted, too crowded, too much road constructions, which leads to many accidents, No more space to walk for pedestrians!
If you don’t earn a descent salary, Paris is too expensive to rent a proper home – a flat with all common amenities like wc, washing machine, etc. I’m in my early thirties, I have a proper office job right now and I live in a cage-size studio with a shared toilet, because simply I cannot afford anything more then this. And it’s really depressive, because I know that anywhere else in Europe I won’t be living in such conditions.
Small salaries is really a big issue in France and especially in the capital. I hardly get the ends meet every month and I’m just sick and tired of not being able to allow myself going to the concert, opera, or a dinner at least once a month…
The last and not the least – French mentality. My goodness…! The most negative, complicated, conflict loving, depressed, unrespectful, messy people in the world. If things can be complicated, they gonna make it complicated for sure.. Parisians are probably even a separate race..
Dating is even another off topic, but finding someone for a serious relationship and settling down in Paris is extremely hard..
Paris is going down by a full speed and it’s really sad to observe what this city has become and what it could be if government and local people would use more their brains and had more common sense. The city has become simply unlivable and no wonder it looses an average amount of 12 000 habitants every year.
So, my days here are also probably started a countdown and 2020 will be the year I’ll finally say good-bye to Paris.
Pamela
As someone BORN there let me say that as to this “speak French fluently or don’t even bother” then where the hell are people supposed to get fluent? Switzerland or Belgium?? Actually that’s what I tell people. Switzerland and Belgium are slightly more forgiving (not. Brussels, of course. If you speak French and sound “Canadian” – well, “English Canadian” meaning Western Canada – they will immediately switch into English and call you an “American!” forever)
The only way to become fluent in French is to LIVE in it. IN it. Immerse yourself in it and it doesn’t help one bit if the rat-bastards around you switcn into English when they hear you speak French (talking to you, Belgium!) I made one enquiry at an English bookstore in cental Paris about staying there in exchange for working at the shoppe, and didn’t follow through because for one thing, fares into central Paris from Orly would have been too much at the time, and the other thing is that as half-Irish, if I want to live in English I’ll go back to Ireland, feck it. And that’s what I’m trying to do now. Head back “across the Channel.” I just have to accept that that “half of who I am” was not meant to be, for a reason.
Daria
Well, I hate Paris, I mean honestly, I hate the way French don’t let their place for a child or a pregnant woman or an old person, I hate their arrogance, I hate their mentality full of stereotypes. I hate pollution, I hate dog poop everywhere, I hate their formalities and contradictions: I guy could go before you into the elevetaor look you in the eye, never say hello, but going out of the elevator he would say: bonne journée, au revoir, bonne journée. I mean I feel they are prisoners of their formalities and Formules de Politesse but they won’t never leave their place for a pregnant woman!
I hate their complex, I hate their long pauses during work days, I mean they have 2 hours lunch break, then 1 hour coffe break for 3 times a day, and then go home at 19:30, I mean do they even see their children? I hate that their children are raised by the nannies. I hate that, they cannot leave work before their boss leaves work. I hate the pollution, I hate the fact that if you want to eat good vegetables and fruits ( made in France) you have to go to the market and pay a lot, else you can go to Carrefour or FranPrix and buy them made in Spain full of pestisides. I hate that girls are very jealous of each other, I hate thart everybody takes every advise as an insult and take it personnaly, I hate that they are very racists, at work they kept trying to know where do I come from since they couldn’t figure out why I don’t have accent when I speak French or English, I hate they teach their children to be racists, they were calling my son: L’enfant canadien, 7 years old boys treating mine as a stranger because he is different. I hate the way of teaching in schools, and their approach towards kids concerning discipline, my son’s prof she dragged him by his hair, the director defended her, so I had to go to the police, my child was abused and the director did nothing. I hate how they treat children in schools, if a child is different he is systematically impolite from their point of view. I hate the fact that there are no parcs for childrend, activities are very expensive and limited.What can I say? I have lot of things about Paris and French People, I mean they need to open their minds a bit, they are becoming behind all nations and countries because of their mentality which sucks. and Yeah Paris sucks
Sia
Hi Daria, sorry your child had to undergo this. It is horrendous. The school system and environment in France is horrendous. I have a French friend, she is an Anglophone her son is facing huge huge difficulties and blame at school for speaking fluent English. He is confused and is going through a hard time. His private school teachers have ‘decided’ that he is difficult and they have suggested my friend to find another school ‘which suits the boy’s temperament better’ ,…… can you believe it? And there are other things. I dont have children so apart from that experience of yours, I agree with you word by word. The jealously among girls makes me literally physically sick. Guys whom I work with look away when we meet by chance in the Metro or in the street. The French mentality and people suck big time. in Paris it is 100 folds.They will never change because then the rest of the world will be too difficult for them. They deal with their misery by HATING everyone and everything.
Louise Eady
OK – I”m a newbie in Paris but I have to say what ruins Paris for me is the French. The men in particular who are almost childish in their arrogance. In Australia, (where men are courteous and not over indulgent paranoid sissys) people are friendly and actually enjoy giving directions to lost travellers or locals. They don’t see it as an opportunity to pull a face, roll their eyes, or worse deliberately send you in the wrong direction. I have met nice Parisians but they are in a very very small minority. While the architecture and sites are breathtaking (in my opinion) the French themselves almost completely ruin the experience. Perhaps it;s the volume of us? Regardless for many we are their bread and butter so they really need to pull that pole out of……….. Ticket booked out – hurrah!
Maikka
Thank you so much for writing this. I am in my 10 months in Paris now from NYC. I still can’t watch any movie set in NYC. To see pictures of NYC hurts too! I moved here for love; we did 3 years of long distance before I moved. Visiting Paris about 7x was such bliss, then I moved and now I call it “a scam”. A lot of Parisians are rude! Administration stuff is such pain in the ass. Never been unemployed this long. Language barrier is real, I’m a grown woman who can’t find the right words to say. To come across your blog is such a relief! Big thanks!
Olga
I lived in Paris for 11 years, came for Sorbonne dream with a nice level of French. With a lot of enthousiasm and force, I don’t even know what to say today, I feel suffocated even if I love the art and history, make a gastonomic blog about French cafe and restaurants, know Paris and Louvre as my pocket, make contact easely with people. It is not enough, because I am not French and never will be. It is funny because in Jack Ryan they tell the same thing.
The Sorbonne University was an enormous dream crash, because its level even is not appreciated here, it is extreamly theoretical, and after getting French degree in management I spent 1,5 year unemployed getting a job by a chance, by the social link of my ex. Even if I had French friends and tryed to fit in, they constantly reminded me that I am not from here and strage.
Geniusly I come to the conclusion that people here are not nice at all, except some minor exception on the South. Looking a their history perhaps it is not suprising. But still as an independante woman, it is a problem for them, because man here like strange sick domination and women are very concurent. Even if I met a lot of people I did not find so much exceptions. In art and theater probably, but unfotunatly I did not get there.
I left Paris 3 years ago for Fontainebleau and travel a lot for my job. Going to a lot of activities and events, still zero connection. And when I come from traveling the suffocation strats again.
It is so hard to live with people with who you can not even talk about some topics, they impose you everything, even to speack low because nobody like loud speacking.
If you come to Paris you need to do like others, to take what you need and go, because otherwise it is not a city to live.
Irène
Honestly, I am really glad that I found your post. I can totaly reason with you. And the worst part is, I speak french fluently but they (my co-workers and clients) always protest that I could not understand the subtlety of french language and the fact that I made a faux pas with my body language.
Anthony
I read a story about a female Turkish actress who had decided to move to Paris with her twin daughters. Apparently she loved Paris and was also married there. I myself have never been to Paris and have over the years heard different stories, good and bad. After reading this article by Karen, I was quite shocked by mostly the negative comments. Someday I will try to visit Paris and see for myself.
thijs
i can’t believe you forgot to write about how shitty and condescending all french people are
Juliano
Well, that could be because she hasn’t met all french people. Just a thought.
Matila
I have to say that I’ve been to Paris a few times and every time I liked it a little less. The first impression was great. Beautiful. Tinsel. But I never met such unempathic people. Unfortunately, I fell in love with a Parisian and struggled for a long time with what we will do because he didn’t want to move. Since I was girlfriend of local, I got into his community, I had an advantage you may think. But only at the level of officialities. They won’t accept you. You feel discarded. You start speaking English and they are gone in a minute. And that prevented me from making the decision to move there for so long. Parties are awesome, food too. But Paris is a cage, where everyone is sitting in their cages and calling it flats and paying crazy amounts for it. Most of them can’t even socialize that much cos to go for a dinner is creepy expensive! I can not imagine why people should not be bitter and negative when for basic human needs such as personal space, nature, whether air alone, it is necessary to either fight or travel. How sad the Parisians themselves don’t see it. They grew up in tinsel and they hold on to it. No wonder, actually. France outside Paris is beautiful, but you have not too many opportunities to make a living – villages, countryside. So they sell their dissatisfaction for money, for living in a shop window. Finally I decided to try and move and guess what? My beloved Parisian already had another Parisian. It took him one week after few years. Because nothing outside Paris is as good as it is in Paris, right? As very telling is this story about their mentality. Everything is replaceable, everything is a thing. Values are elsewhere. As it mentioned few times, one has to have a really thick skin and a great deal of phlegmatism. Nor does it guarantee that they will not destroy you.
Anne
Hi Matila Thank you for this heartfelt post. I agree with almost everything you have written here. mostly with ‘You feel discarded’ . In fact I understood the what ‘discarded’ felt like after I moved to Paris. It is not easy to process that about oneself. Trust you are shining where you are.
Juliano
I’m a parisian by birth (well, south suburbs to be sharp), I’d been living there the first 19 years of my life, and again the 23rd. I know some people wouldn’t live anywhere else, but I wasn’t cut for it and I realized this when we moved to Toulouse for my dad’s work. I found life really easier in a smaller town (4th in France) where almost everything is within walking distance, and a 20 minutes drive will have you in the countryside, surounded by trees, fields and small villages. These big cities are not on a human scale, one needs a bit of nature every now and then and it’s just too far away. Something that really depressed me was the feeling of being an ant, you took the metro and every station was crowded, people running in the tunnels as soon as they heared the noise of a train coming in the station without even knowing if it was theirs and I thought “how many stations are there? This very scene is happening right now in each of them, how many of us are there, running like headless chickens trying to catch a train?” As for human relations, I found people in Toulouse very welcoming -well, you’re always going to meet some who are not and are going to call you « the parisian », as accents between Toulouse and Paris are really, really different and any local could tell where I came from after a 10 secs speech- and very kind, eager to help. I remember my mum being answered in quite a rude way by an employee in La Samaritaine (or was it the BHV?) in Paris, you could clearly tell that she felt helping customers find the right area of the shop wasn’t on her job description. This never ever happened in Toulouse, I was amazed at how friendly and smiling vendors were and how I had accepted rude and unfriendly behaviour as a standard. When living in Paris people are under such stress, being so far from nature, having to spend hours in public transportation, living in small flats that it’s bound to take its toll on their morale, growing there you get accustomed to it and you end up thinking it is normal for employees to answer without a smile and in a robotic way, so much so that I even felt guilty when being answered sarcastically if my question was a bit silly, which is going to happen to anyone every now and then. (asking a silly question, that is)
Dog poo… don’t get me started about it, I sometimes dream of having a long range rifle, stalk dog owners from a faraway rooftop and shoot the poor animal if its master doesn’t clean up its feeces. I know it’d be unfair to the dog but hey, I reckon I’d risk far more for shooting the human being. When it’s rainy the poo gets splattered allover the sidewalks, you’re walking your kids to school and you have to be extra careful not to slip on it, it’s like real life mud day. Better not be in a hurry. This is true for every big town in France, unfortunately.
The bureaucracy. Well, it can be a nightmare indeed. From my experience, it looks like in each administration service you have ONE person and one only who knows every rule in the book, and who’s going to give you the right information for tricky and unusual issues. You’d better be lucky and be drawn with him/her, or only be there for a run of the mill procedure. Everyone else looks lost when your request is in the slightest bit more complicated than a standard issue, and they have to call that person to get it done, that’s if they can be bothered. There is a real problem with french administration, far too many civil servants don’t seem to be instructed that they’re here to help people, there definitely is some king of entitlement feeling to some of them as the have « sécurité de l’emploi », they don’t risk being fired. Fortunately, I have found that the administration made great improvements in digitalizing procedures, and plenty of them can actually be made online. You’ll still have to understand french though, as I doubt they translate their pages. For example, I lost my carte grise (vehicle’s certificate) and I could reorder it and have it sent by mail in less than a week, avoiding the dreaded trip to the Préfecture and the everlasting waiting lines.
After having lived in several cities in France (Toulouse, Bordeaux, Tarbes, Pau) I’ve been in Nice for the last 20 years, and it is home. People are more relaxed and more friendly than in Paris, nature is close (the sea is litterally meters away, ski resorts are one hour and an half away and Italy half an hour)
I work in retail sales, we have lots of visitors from everywhere and I try and be careful, nice and welcoming. I often cross a street to offer help if I see tourists looking at a map, sometimes with luggage trying to find their airbnb. It makes me feel good to greet people from all around the world and be a small part of an enjoyable vacation time. I know I’ve sometimes made mistakes, and I try and not make them again. I once answered in a way I meant to be light hearted banter, and it came across as awfully rude. I can also relate to what Pamela wrote as I also answered an american lady who was addressing me in decent french in her mothertongue and she let me know that she wasn’t pleased about it, rightly so. It wasn’t meant to be rude as I just enjoy speaking english, but it wasn’t thoughtful and I’ve learned my lesson, I’ll only speak in english if I’m asked to now.
That being said, and even if stereotypes have a certain truth to them, generalization isn’t a good thing. You’ll find nice people and mean people everywhere, even in Paris, you just have to keep the formers and let go of the latters and remember that behaviour isn’t always constant, we’re humans not robots and every once in a while circumstances will have us behave in a way we’ll then regret, but it’s too late to make amends. It’s up to us to try and not take things personnally and not let it bring us down, life’s too short for that. I’m sorry about your experience in Paris, but please don’t let it cloud your judgement of french people in general.
Joe
What I’ve noticed in this area where we live, 130km from Paris, Loiret, is that people are not sociable. I mean, we invited people over a couple of times, for barbecues or just drinks and apéritives, but they never returned the invitation even if everytime they really enjoyed their time here. Almost all are the same age, but surprisingly the only ones that said “let’s have a barbaque when the weather allows” were two parents, around 45 years old. The ones our age, 30 or under, nothing… Never… So we gave up inviting them because since they never said anything about getting together, for me it’s a sign of “We are not interested in you”. Then again, accepting our invitations doesn’t connect to that… Really weird behavior.
So, we will only stay here for a max of 2 years because we basically have 0 social life,and then move to a city, not a big one, but touristic, where people are more sociable. I found that there are many similarities to Romanian people, that was one of the main reasons we eventually moved here from UK, were the differences were far too big. But what we didn’t know is that in semi rural or rural areas people don’t really like to get together. Or not the young ones at least…
Natalia
Thanks very much for sharing this. I’m not form the US, I’m from Chile and I’ve living in Paris for 3 years. At the beginning I really loved it but after the first 6 months I started to hate it. People here is just not nice. And also there is something in the vibe. I started to hate the smell of people in the subway, the smell of pee everywhere, the smell of cigarettes in all restaurants and bars. I even started to hate how French people speak and I can’t stand sometimes being in a room with only French people, it’s just overwhelming. Even if my French it’s quite good they always make fun of my accent. I’ve really tried to integrate into the culture but it’s just so difficult because the won’t let you. And also, like you, nobody understands me when I sya that I’m unhappy here. I hope I will leave soon, I’m looking for a position abroad but I’m afraid that the next city will be worst than Paris xD
k.
Best of luck Natalia! I’ve heard that smaller cities can be much friendlier/better than Paris from friends, so don’t give up entirely! I hope that you find somewhere that you love.
Karen
Thank you for writing and sharing this! I am laughing that this is similar to my thought on living in the city you like, Amsterdam. From the dog poop and lack of common courtesy and feeing guiltily for not feeling as lucky as you should.
Paula
I think the phrase “Paris sucks” does not describe how much it actually sucks. As most people in the comments and you said, it is very nice to visit with pockets full of cash and no intention to deal with French people except the waiters.
I’ve been in Paris for almost two years now and although I love the architectures, numerous museums, nice sceneries, possibility to jump on a train and be in another city in just a few hours, I completely and utterly dislike French people and general and their pretentious, dull and arrogant personalities, as well as Paris. For me, French people kind of ruin the nice things about France, because in the end, they are more or less the same, they have read the same French books, they know the same French movies or music and they do not know anything else besides that. It feels like nothing else exists and that the only good thing in this world is – France.
If I hear once more “I had to take this very competitive exam” (I work in Ecole Polytechnique), as the rest of the world in other countries did not have to struggle, study their asses off for more than 2 years in prépa, I will shoot myself.
All this moi moi moi attitude and we the French and viva la Fronce – OMG! The only thing that remains is that they are arrogant, boring, unwelcoming and not opened to any other culture than theirs.
I will not even start with the dirtiness and the fact that all of them will explain it to you how all the rest of the world is dirty as well. I mean, there is only one city in the world that is advertised as the city of love, luxury and richness, and that is Paris. So when someone tells me how Hong Kong is not so clean or New York, I just politely remind them that they should not advertise it as such, but just a random capital and it will be okay.
The luxury and fine wine kind of get washed the moment you step into the poop or when you are getting suffocated in the pee smell the moment the sun starts to shine. Everywhere you see only homeless people and no one gives one single penny to help them, especially when someone begs in the metro. It is simply horrible. and utterly unkind.
They think the French way to do things is the only way and that is completely disrespectful towards everyone else as each time they go abroad that is exactly what they want – to be accepted as they are, as French, but they do not give expats the same generosity.
One of the best things in this world is a variety of people and cultures around the world. We have so much to learn from each other! But in France (yeah I know when in Rome, do as Romans do) the only way to be accepted is to be 100% francophile. That is the only way.
The wages are low, the food is good but super expensive and if you are vegan good luck in affording anything as the only thing you can buy in normal stores is that horrible Bjorg brand! If you live outside the city centre is even more terrible as it takes you 1h hour in a smelly-packed-like-sardines-in-the-can to reach the centre… The trains and buses are never on time, so many strikes and the things are just getting worse. There is literally nothing to do as everything is in Paris’ centre or you cannot really afford it anyway.
Personally, I do not know anyone who works these 35 famous hours, but most people either work 50 hours or pretend they are working so much as when you leave on time, you are being perceived as lazy.
Even in less advanced countries in case you want a drug prescription you call your doctor or everything is already online so you just hop to the pharmacy… same goes for everything else…in France, it feels like middle ages. They are so very behind and refuse to upgrade and change because then they would have to admit it’s all shit.
I had the opportunity to live in Istanbul and Proto before coming to Paris and for both cities, I cannot tell you which one I adored the most. People were so nice, helpful and genuinely caring – never have I ever felt unwelcome, unwanted or alienated.
I am fascinated by the fact that no one ever asked me something about me, but they enjoy talking about themselves! It is simply amazing. It is so hard to befriend someone here, but that is because they all have friends from high-school and they do not wish to put in any effort to meet new people. Plus, god forbid if they pay a coffee for you, but they do like to have it on your account. 😀
My friends are mostly expats, although my boyfriend is French, which is why we are here in the end. All my friends say the same thing and two of them recently moved to the UK because they felt completely unwelcomed. They are Indians and they did experience some racists comments and similar things, which made them want to leave even more!
My French is pretty decent, but still, they correct you for every single thing which mostly comes down to the accent and not the grammar. I find that douche baggy as their English is mostly terrible, although younger generations tend to be a bit better at it. My friends from Italy speak French, but with an Italian accent and each time he comes to the supermarket to buy a lemon or something, he usually tries with French “Un lemon (more like l-iiii-mon as in Italy) svp.”, but the lady never understands him (read as always pretends his French is so so shitty she cannot comprehend him) so he just says “One lemon please”. It’s just so horrible and funny at the same time. Probably grotesque in the end, and sad. Very very sad.
Fuck Paris, indeed. I cannot wait to leave after my contract expires. But also I know I will love to come back for a visit! There are amazing things to see in Paris, but it is just horrendous to live in.
Not Just Another Milla
Thoroughly enjoyed reading this. After a 3 year stint in Paris, I left Paris 8 years ago. Initially, I loved it and, even now, I enjoy returning as an off-season tourist. However, living there was bleak. So much bureaucracy, very expensive, dirty, and just not for me. I connected with your words because I also found that others couldn’t understand my disappointment and frustration.
Jesse Czelusta
Thanks for sharing your experience! It’s definitely useful to hear multiple perspectives, and it sounds like you and yours made the right decision given your preferences and situation.
As someone who is working to move our little family to France — and Paris in particular — I’m actually finding it difficult to come across positive reviews of Paris. Most people seem to share some version of your sentiments. No one says, “Yes, come to Paris and all will be well!” Still, I think it’s the right move for us, perhaps not forever, but at least for a while.
As a French friend told me: “Life isn’t an adventure. It’s a series of adventures.” So chapeau to you for having an adventure, learning, and moving on the to the next.
grapevine
Hi,
Well, I live in a big city in the northwest of France (2 hours away from Paris by train) and I feel very similar. I haven’t lived in other regions of France. For me it is the “people’s culture”, the lack of “empathy” of most people and the fact that I find them rather cold. It is like “emotional intelligence is absent everywhere”. Of course I have got French friends and you will say “there are nice people everywhere”. Yes, but from MY experience over the last 15 years living here, It is weird: I feel that, on the one hand, they take themselves really seriously, they judge others continuously and yet, they are not self aware at all about the way they behave. No self criticism whatsoever, but all the judgement goes towards other countries or cultures. F.. them. It is clear that I haven’t adapted. One day I’d like to leave (it is going to depend on work opportunities, though) and I am in a long relationship and in my early fifties. If I find a proper job in the UK for instance, I’ll leave it all behind. Even If it means leaving (and living) on my own. FREEDOM it is called 😉
Ronnie
I am so happy too read all of your comments and I couldn’t agree more.
I am sorry France, but you are the country of nonsense. You are difficult and your bureaucracy is a killer.
I have been waiting for my cart vitale (affiliation to French health system) for over 7 months, and after dozens of letters and phone calls – finally, I got it!! Just wonder why after so much hard work they still managed to mess it up and print my husband surname as mine, even though there is no single document of me with that surname.
The difficulty of opening a bank account that is another story and it makes me want to keep the money in a sock under my bed.
I do not understand how it was possible for me to open a bank account in UK from Malaysia or Germany from France, but it is not possible to do it online even though I live here!
Why, to change my address in my bank ( once I managed to open it in person, because forget about online in France) I have to travel to the office where I have opened it (because forget about online)?
Letters, letters. letters. France loves letters. If you want to live in France, get yourself good printer-that is essential, but first of all, you need patience, a lot of it. And if your french is not so great..life will be even harder.
I used to live in London and maybe I just got spoiled, but everything is just so much easier there.
You can find all info online and you get done literally everything online.
I feel extremely frustrated here, helpless and stupid because that’s how people will make you feel here.
I wanna get out!
Magda
Thank you for this articile. I have lived (survived) three years in Paris and left feeling exhausted. I share many of your experiences. I unfortunately became very stressed and agressive as a result. Also a bit assertive which is good. I am now temporarily living in Lyon, and only now understanding that I do not wish to be surrended by French people who attack you with no reason, judge you, and can not be bothered to do their job (administrations, jobs, recruitment), and complain all the time. They go on strikes all the time and have one of the best social benefits in the world. I would never again go back to PAris unless I had a husband making 5000EUR net to provide some security. I came to Paris after years in UK and it was a shock. People using your telephone number that you left looking for a room to flat to flirt with you???? seriously? sex for accommodation offers?? I have a B2/C1 French, have worked in French in my home country but they dismiss my work experience in my home country in one of the largest corporation in the world that they can not pronunce the name of!! 🙂 Many people offer illegal work, illegal flat which impact your security. Thinking to move to a more civilized, happier and less agressive country now with the intention to restricts purchases of “made in France” products for a lifetime.